Archive Result

;;Sound file 20040430GRJHNLRE1

Speaker Gelek Rimpoche

Location Jewel Heart Netherlands

Topic Reincarnation

Transcriber Vickii Cahill

Date April 25, 2022

GR: Welcome here in Utrecht. And thank you for the nice introduction which I didn’t even hear (??). But I heard the welcome. And very happy to be here. And thank you for all of you to be here today. (DT) Ok. And we have a nice, beautiful small group here today. So, we can be very, doesn’t have to be formal. We can be relaxed and spend time and talk about it. (DT) And before we get started relaxing and talk and we have to, to provide some basis on which we talk. (DT) I believe the subject is; continuation, karma and reincarnation. Is it right? Or could you say it the right thing in Dutch. (DT) So, it’s almost like a continue what we started last night in Nijmegen. So, there’s same. It’s almost the same and they linked up altogether. (DT) So, what we talked last night in Nijmegen. How many here today who are not been there last night? Can I raise hands? Most of you. So. Most of you. So. What we did last night in Nijmegen, we basically. We, sort of, basically talked about the mind and then death stage. So, I probably has to, to retouch with this mind thing today.

0:03:05.6 Little more. Because time was very short last night. Last night is about a two-hour thing. So, today we have whole day. So, it might not be. Before we talk continuation. Before we talk karma. Before we talk reincarnation. The question is, “Who is continuing? Who is reincarnating? Who experience the karma?” And I think these are the main points we have to slightly touch it. (DT) Did we get there yet? (DT) Hmm? So, of course there is many ways of people talking about mind and all of those. And but Buddhism have its own way of presenting; introducing mind. (DT) Actually, I would like to put in a little different way today. When you look in everything existing in this. You know, whatever you look. And wherever you look, whatever you touch, whoever you see, whatever you do, you’ll find everything. If you can divide it into two things. One. I don’t know whether we should say divide it.

0:05:59.5 But whatever we see, touch, hear, everything has some form. Form with form. (DT) Right? If you’re looking at the person. People, there’s physical form. You identify. I said last night, “Our physical body is our identity.” (DT) And if you look at the house. And they’re all forms. (DT) And where does the forms come from? (DT) They, all this forms are. It is collectively produced. It is collection of its own little particles. The atoms. They all combine together, then you have established this form. (DT) So, now. Now. So, when it becomes form, it blocks. Right? It blocks the empty space. It occupies empty space, so it blocks. (DT) For example, my hand cannot go below this, because this one blocks. (DT) So, so Buddhists. Buddha choose to call, these are 0:08:24.7 (Tibetan: top che,) which means something blocks something. (DT) Now the other side. What is left is, no blocking. (DT) None blocking means there is no particle collections or no atoms or nothing. Sort of, it is space like empty. (DT)

0:09:09.7 So, the. When you talk about the body and the mind of the human beings. As we human beings. So, body and mind of the human beings. We are talking about it. The body is the blocking business. (DT) Now, the mind is non-blocking (DT) It is empty. (DT) It is blank. (DT) Right? Empty blank. (DT) But if you think that is emptiness, you’re mistaken. I just said this because some people may think it. Otherwise, there’s no reason why I have to say. Particularly those of you. Not so much exposed of. Anyway. So. (DT) So, you get it? So, mind is the blank part of it. (DT) So, no color, (DT) no shape, (DT) not tangible. (DT) Well, the word tangible is another strange word. It’s not physically tangible. (DT) It is comprehensible. (DT) Right? Are you with me? I mean, most of you. Are you with me or no? (DT) Or is it too strange or too abstract? (DT) Ok. If you say you’re ok, I’ll go. So, in phenomena, in actual existence, in phenomena. What happened is, this blocking thing will never become a non-blocking. Non-blocking thing never becomes a blocking style. (DT)

0:12:11.1 So, the great early Indian masters, because of that reason, great early Indian masters says, “No consciousness can become non-consciousness. Neither the non-consciousness can become consciousness. At anytime, anywhere, under any circumstances, because it is two separate things in total existence.” (DT) So, now if you begin to think within yourself. You begin to think two parts of you. The outer physical identity part of you and inner self, or the person or being or as Buddhists, you may have to call it consciousness. Or in normal western sense, you may call it soul. Or I don’t know. Person or personality. Whatever the terminologies that you use. And you begin to see two within ourselves. Are you with me? (DT) So, that doesn’t mean we have a split personality. So, you really have to think that. (DT) Because right now I do not know many of you. I couldn’t figure out. Many of you probably look to ourselves and just say “me”.

0:15:01.5 And without getting any specifically looking into, my body or my mind or my soul or my consciousness. We just simply say, “me” with no division for whatsoever. And we may be used to it for that. And when I try to introduce to you, saying, “Hey, there’s two separate ones.” You may think split personality. I’m not talking about that. (DT) So, now the second question comes. I said the mind is blank and spacelike and all of those. So, now you may think, every open space is mind. I don’t think you think anyway but, for the sake of saying it. (DT) Since there is no form. So, there’s no measurement. Size or anything. No measurement. Right? Because when you measure, there’s something to be measured. (DT) When there’s nothing to be measured, so there’s no measurement. (DT) So, then there. Yet, every open space is not our mind. (DT) Somehow our mind is right now captured in our body. (DT) It may travel outside, but it lives inside. Otherwise, we’re in trouble. (DT) That is one of the reason also, mind has no limit for whatsoever. No limitations. No limitations. (DT)

0:18:02.9 So. So, now the question comes, “What is? What does? What is the definition of mind really is?” You know, “What is definition of mind? What makes it mind?” Because every empty is not mind. Every mind is not blank space. So, what do you say mind? What makes this mind? The definition of mind is really called, lucid, cognitive. (DT) Lucid means clarity. Right? Clear. Clear. (DT) What does clear mean to you? (DT) There are many ways of being clear. When there’s nice, beautiful light, we can see this cup. So nicely. It is clear to me; it is a mug. (DT) How do I see this as a mug? Mug. (DT)

Translator: mok

GR: Yeah. Huh?

Translator: That’s the Dutch word.

GR: Oh, mok. Ok. Anyway. How do I say mug or mok, whatever, mok, whatever it is. How do I see this? Because you know, this object, the form is right here and plus there’s light from outside. Then the light hits this object. Object reflects my eye. My eyesight reflects the light back. And then we recognize. I mean, that’s, that’s normal process anyway. Whether you think or you don’t think, that’s exactly how it. How we perceive. (DT) So, it depends on the light (DT)

0:21:02.7 And if the light is not clear, we will see. Where is mug? Look like but doesn’t really show what design is this. Is it flower, leaf or whatever? You know. (DT) So, when you get good light, you say, “Ha. It is leaves.” (DT) So, it clearly seen as leaves. (DT) So, the mind’s clarity is not like this. It doesn’t depend on light. (DT) When you talk about clarity in mind, the mind has. It is sort of a natural capacity. Natural capacity to pick that up. (DT) And it almost produces a duplicate within the mind itself. (DT) And mind you, I used the word almost. Because you cannot go on and say, it duplicates. Because it’s not a xerox machine. So. But it’s almost like, you know, duplicating. (DT) So, what does they do? What does mind do with that duplication? (DT) Mind, again, almost becoming that. (DT) And that’s why we pick up good qualities, bad habits. We get addictions. I mean, there’s physical addictions, but forget about that. The mental addictions. That because way it is lucid and clear to mind it’s different than we see with the eye. Or reflection in the mirror.

0:24:04.2 And these three, you know, they’re all different. The mind is almost picking up duplicate and almost becoming of it. (DT) And that’s why people can meditate. That’s why people can pray. That’s why people been asked to be, to do good things. And not been asked. But that’s why, that’s why how people become better person. That’s how individual improves. I mean the, every foundation of improvement, of whether it is spiritual or educational or knowledge or whatever. Because of mind. Have that capacity. That’s how it functions. That’s why it gets in there. That’s why it remains in there. (DT) Did you get this? (DT) This is something quite important. Important. This is where the material world is more important, or spiritual world is more important to the individual. It really made on this basis. I mean, the reason you boil down to, “why, why, why” if you come, ask questions. It will bottom line it will come to that. (DT) Because of that, people can develop.

0:27:01.6 Because of that people can be enlightened. Because of that, people can become better. That’s. That’s the bottom line. (DT) And if it’s not there, then you cannot change anything. (DT) No matter how much you change; it will be like a polishing. Silver polishing, gold polishing or something. Because if it doesn’t get in there it will be simply, no matter how much you add, it becomes addition. It doesn’t become of it. (DT) So, that’s what lucid is all about it, mind. (DT) If you think the lucid is some kind of block. Something block eliminating light, which lot of people think that way .And if you think that way, then it’s a nice light. What can you do? (DT) Did you get that?

Translator: No. Sorry.

GR: The lucid mind is. Mind. When we say lucid, this is the “why it’s lucid”. If it’s only you think lucid, the moment you use lucid mind. So, if you think there is a little bulb like mind which is radiating light. Which normally we always think. Every religious tradition, whether it is Judeo-Christian or Hindu-Buddhist, whatever, they radiate lights all the time. From whatever. Image. And if you cannot imagine they make electrical lights go zift, zift, zift, zift, zift. All the time. Right? If you think that way, then you are fundamentally wrong. (DT) So, it’s the other way. Lucid nature means it is clear, blank. And everything is possible to reflect. And way and how it reflects. It picks up. (DT)

0:30:11.7 And when I said, “Blank. Lucid. And picks up.” You may think you pick up piece of fruit and show in front of mirror. Then you have the reflection of the fruit in the mirror. So, you may think that way. If you think that way, that’s wrong. (DT) Why it is wrong? Because that existence is “depends on the fruit outside”. Whatever they have in there is only a reflection. Nothing more than that. (DT) What mind have in there is real. Not a reflection. It is real. That’s why I said, almost look like duplicate. (DT) Did you get me at all? (DT) If you don’t get that, the idea of improving individual; doesn’t really get it. It’s almost like persistently forcing on you, forcing on self and pushing and pushing and pushing. And hope somewhere, sometime, it may become something. So, that’s only we’re stuck with that idea for so many of people do that. They do. They put efforts for spiritual path. They do their deeds They do everything. But some kind of hope, somewhere, sometime, something will work out. So, it somehow, sort of, hitting on your head. Boom, boom, boom. You know. So. Nothing really happening. But it keep on hitting. We do this because we really didn’t get how mind works. (DT)

0:33:13.8 Anyway. Marianne, you have some burning question. I hear nothing. I’m sorry.

Marianne: This is a question about healing(???)8

Translator: Yes?

Marianne: How does it work? (?????)

Translator: You understood the question?

GR: You will repeat in Dutch. (DT) When, let’s say. When the mind become. When the mind is observing; witnessing anger or compassion. What does this blank pure mind do? They pick up this anger or compassion. Whatever. Whatever. And it sort of becoming part of this mind. Again, when you say part. There’s nothing to be divided. This part is this. This part is that. It is like a, like having oil on piece of old paper. An old-fashioned paper. When you have the oil. Even the new ones. The new ones don’t go that much. The old-fashioned papers, you know, when you drop oil, sort of goes in that way. Very similar to that. That anger. I didn’t say you pick up anger. I used the word, look like. There’s a lot of reasons why it look like. Because when I look at you and I pick up your structure, and then whatever I’m picking up, it look like you. I am not picking you up, putting in my mind. That’s why it look like. But formless things, thoughts, such as mental faculties. Such as anger or compassion or something. When it picks up and it sort of adapted that. and it is becoming that.

0:36:01.0 So, the mind becomes anger. The mind becomes compassion. Theoretically, it is wrong, but literally and practically that’s right. (DT) And that is the extraordinary quality of the mind, which no one else have it. The mirror doesn’t have it. Eye doesn’t have it. No one else have it. The real principal mind have that quality. (DT) So, when you meditate on compassion, if you keep on meditating compassion. And the compassion, picked it up by your mind, remains longer and longer and longer and longer. When you’re becoming that, then finally your mind is becoming compassion nature longer and longer and longer and finally it becomes that. (DT) So does the anger. If you keep on concentrating on anger, hatred, anger, hatred; your mind picking up anger, hatred more and more and more and remaining in there and then finally you’ll become hatred or angry person. (DT)

0:39:15.9 Then you’ll lose the value of a human being. Human value. (DT) And then you don’t care. (DT) No matter how many you kill. (DT) No hesitation. (DT) And that’s how the war’s working. (DT) I mean, this is what we are going through today. And the war’s going on. The terrorist is going on. And everything is going on. (DT) That because of the mind becoming in that way. (DT) And that’s why we as a human being, we have the choice whether we want to do the right thing or the wrong thing. (DT) Otherwise we think, why should I do the right thing? Because it’s good thing to do. What you mean by “good thing to do”? You don’t have any more reason. Because it’s kind. Because it’s good. Because it’s kind. Because people said so. Sort of you go back and forth, because you don’t have a good enough reason. (DT) And when you know, I become bad. (DT) Then the question comes, “Do I like to be bad or I don’t want to be bad?” (DT) Did you get me? (DT) So, that is the basic foundation why people look for spiritual path. (DT) Did you get it? I’m not sure. Ok. I will. I don’t know. I thought I made nice contribution to you. But I don’t know whether you get it or not. (DT)

0:42:08.3 Anyway. So, that is the mind. (DT) How do I look at the mind? How do I meditate on the mind? It is different subject. I’m not even going to talk today. That’s a lot. (DT) So, since I’m supposed to talk continuation. So, I introduced the mind. So, what does the mind do? Does mind dies? The truly; truly, the vocabulary of “die”, “living” is not applicable for the mind. (DT) If you have to fill up some forms. (DT) If you have to fill up some forms. In this level, you have to fill up NA, not applicable. (DT) You get it? I mean, it’s really not applicable. Why it’s not applicable. You know the. What we’re talking about death, it looks like something ending. End of it. And what is really ending here is the physical identity. Not the mind itself or not the being or not the soul. (DT) It is also simple reason, “all souls are old souls”. (DT) Theoretically Buddhism doesn’t talk about soul at all. They talk about consciousness. (DT)

0:45:02.6 Forget about these religious connotations in between. And the bottom line is the same thing they’re talking about. Except the difference; soul is permanent and the 0:45:13.9 (???) and the (??). They are the technicalities. Going beyond all this. Bottom line. Bottom line. It’s the same thing. (DT) Now, me.

Audience: Can 0:45:48.6 (???)I ask a question first.

GR: Sure.

Audience: (Dutch)

Translator: (Dutch) I’ll try to translate. Correct me if I go wrong. Ok?

GR: He can speak English

Translator: Yeah. Why not?

GR: Why not?

Audience: Thinking about the.

Translator: The lucidity

Audience: Yeah. About lucidity again.

GR: Lucid mind. Yeah

Translator: Rimpoche, help me if I’m going wrong because its complex question, I think. She said, “Well, if the mind is lucid and clear, then how get it attracted or got to certain things? Like what makes it go to compassion or to anger.” You mean that kind of thing? And she said, “What is actually the guiding principle? Normally, I think, it would be ego. But if you die, ego collapses. Or disappears? And then consciousness goes on. So, what it actually makes you do? the lucidity in the mind. What makes it do that, what it does? To get attracted to compassion. To get to. Isn’t that?

0:48:02.6 Audience: Yeah, If there are guiding principle.

Translator: The guiding principle. She asked. What makes it do what it do? What it does?

GR: Very Western minded. Rule oriented. It has to be rule in this way. Has to be that way. Right? (DT) I don’t think all minds follow that much rules. (DT) You know what they say, 0:48:40.3 (Tibetan: Sem Kye ren tsal wa….) The nature of the mind id lucid. And every other things are temporary. I mean, like anger. Or what they said, like anger and all of them are temporary. Which means, not only the anger and all this are temporary, but also faith and all this stuff. Positive, compassion. All are temporary too. Because there cannot be the good ones are temporary. The bad ones temporary and the good ones permanent There cannot be. In nature. It should be equal level. So, what happens is, when the individual keep on putting efforts and keeping it more and longer and time to put efforts. Then it’s maintaining more. Every time. Every time when you maintain more and more and more, since it is picked as part of it and it becomes compassionate or it becomes hatred person. Becomes compassionate person. And I don’t know whether it is 0:49:59.4 (?) attacked or anything or not attacked any all.(?) I don’t think there is. I think it is the, what we offer them. What we show them. What we bring to them. That makes the difference.

Audience: Who is the “we”?

GR: That’s a good question. Who is? Very good thinking. Who is we? So, you forced me to bring one more complicated thing.

Translator: Can I first translate this?

GR: Oh, sorry, sorry. Ok.

0:50:36.7 (DT)

0:51:32.3 Whether my mind is me or my body is me. Or is there something separate called me. The true idea is something separate called me. Beyond my mind. Beyond my body. It brings lot of complications I’m trying to keep quiet. But the. But the thing is, my mind is not really me. My body is not really me. But my mind is more closer to me than my body is. So, my mind, “me” functions according to my mind functions. But if you really look at it. If you really look at it. Mind and me have to separate. I mean, that is a little, quite a deep philosophical things. You have to be. You may have to be little rocket science here. (DT) The beautiful thing is, at the end of all this. And when you’re searching something. And you’re never going to find it. (DT) That’s because of the emptiness. (DT) It’s not because you cannot clarify. It goes in pieces, pieces, pieces and pieces. And pieces. And that’s why. (DT) It is easy to talk on the form than on mind. (DT) When you’re looking at the form, you cut the forms into pieces.

0:54:02.8 Look at it. I don’t know. Look at the glass. And look at the glass. You can divide tremendously. How many particles in here? (DT) You go down and down and down. No matter how quickly you go down. You will never going to have, this is the end of the particles. I can never divide beyond that. You can never find it. Gone beyond our human mind, I and all capacities. Not mind, but I (?) capacity. Go way beyond that and you’ll get still divide, divide, divide, divide. (DT) East never touch West. (DT) No matter how tiny it might . I mean like, you know, the scientists did the same thing. It’s nothing big about the religion. The scientist does the same thing. They go and go and search and then say. Finally, they say, “This is atom.” (DT) Then they go beyond that. They say, “Oh, there’s a neutron.” This thing, this thing, that thing. There’s an endless thing goes on. (DT) So, this is really exactly the Buddha’s wisdom. I’m not saying the Buddha is scientist or the scientist knows Buddha’s wisdom. But this is the real Buddha’s wisdom of emptiness comes out of that. (DT) So, they collectively existing is enough. Good enough to be. (DT)

Translator: Rimpoche

GR: So, anyway. What’s happening?

Translator: Break

GR: Break? I’m not ready to go for break yet.

Translator: Ok

GR: Ok. There. The point is. Now the point what I’d like to establish before this break is, we took break. So, the reason, right from the beginning, I divided every phenomena into form and formless. Form and. Again, the formless is wrong language.

0:57:04.8 The form and mind. I’m sorry. Form and mind. So, what happens is: 0:57:13.5 (Tibetan: Num che mig me num…..) Non-forms. Oh, I said that. Right? The forms never become mind. And the mind never become other materials. (DT) So, all minds are mind right from the beginning. And it will remain as mind forever. (DT) And non-mind will never become mind. (DT) So, which means, the limitations you begin to see. Right? Limitations. The mind is always mind. Non-mind is always non-mind. (DT) So, now you have mind. I have mind. We all have mind. And so, these are the continuing mind. (DT) Do you see that? When we die, for us it is think end of it, because we have lost identity. But the mind is still there. Otherwise, if mind dies, one day the mind will be finished. There will be no more mind left. Right? It never becomes. Mind become more and more in the world today. (DT) So, what’s happening is, the mind is circulating. (DT) Going through a process and reappearing. I mean, I don’t want to say but it is recycling. (laughs) Sounds terrible. But you know. (DT) And that is the principle of continuation, anyway. (DT)

1:00:00.1 Alright. Now. What am I supposed to do?

Translator: A little coffee break.

GR: Coffee beak. Ok? Til what time? (DT)

So, the reincarnation or the incarnation is a difficult subject to comprehend. Because we are still not clear whether the metals can become a person or person has to be a person. We are not clear on that. I mean, majority of the people are not clear on that.

Translator: I missed. You said metal?

GR: The metals. The brass and iron and all this. All the metals. Every thing metals like, you know, wood.

Audience: Alchemy

Translator: I’ll try to translate. (dutch) (DT) And then I lost it. Sorry Rimpoche. Could you repeat?

GR: Well, actually people are talking about artificial intelligence

Translator: Oh

GR: And artificial intelligence is made out of computer and metals and you know. All of this. And the physical particles. Physical particles put together. And whether they can become a being. Or the being can become them. It is a big issue. We are not clear. I mean, as far as, as the world is concerned. It is never cleared yet. (DT) And so that’s why the incarnation is difficult. (DT) If you have belief system you follow.

1:03:03.5 Because Buddha said so, I believe it. (DT) And that’s one thing. I’m not saying it’s a good thing or bad thing. It’s almost like, “God says so.” You know, I’m not that’s good thing or bad thing. I’m not saying anything. But that’s one thing. I’m not saying good or bad. That’s it. That’s one thing. (DT) That doesn’t convince our mind. (DT) I mean, we need to know solidly the reasons behind. (DT) So, I rely on the “Form doesn’t become non-form and non-form doesn’t become form.” (DT) So, that’s why the metals cannot become mind. (DT) But on the other hand, the artificial intelligence is possible. You cannot rule out. It will be there for sure. (DT) Why? Because when the conditions are right, the result will be there. (DT) When the computer or whatever it is come to the right condition, there will be a consciousness will occupy in that. (DT) Rather than this computer becomes artificial intelligence. (DT) Even the scientists knows this. It’s the funny part of it. (DT) The one of the top guys in the artificial intelligence is a professor called Ray Kurzweil. (DT) He’s talking. He’s now saying, “I’m going to capture a consciousness. I’m going to put in the computer. “ That’s what he’s spending his time and billions of dollars. To try to capture a conscious and try to put in the computer. (laughs) (DT)

1:06:14.8 So, anyway. So, even the scientists now knew there is a need of consciousness to have life. (DT) So, that means life is something different than the metals that we see. The material things. (DT) So, which means, when the Buddha says, “Non-consciousness will not become consciousness. Consciousness will not become non-consciousness.” It might be even proving by science now. (DT) It is fantastic. I mean, it is fantastic in one way. It’s really. It’s fantastic one way, because a lot of those Buddha’s what we call it, religious statements are; are scientifically it’s proven now. Because, because it’s a wonderful thing. When you look at the theory of relativity. Of Einstein’s theory of the relativity, it really makes Buddha idea of emptiness, is doable and understandable. (DT) Buddha’s idea of, you know, pure land has been, sort of, you know, overlapping on the existing land is also now possible to be understood by us because of the computer. (DT) So it is, it is in a way very exciting.

1:08:59.1 Which we considered as sort of, almost like a religion’s belief or philosophical complicated issue is almost one after the another, proven by the scientists through; coming from completely different directions. (DT) So, whether they’re prove it or not prove it, the consciousness remains consciousness. So. So, there’s a limited consciousness. Consciousness is something never produced. Never produced by. I mean, you can’t say it’s not collectively produced. Otherwise, I’m wrong from Buddhist viewpoint. But. But it’s sort of never produced. (DT) Nor, I become you. You become me. That’s not possible either. (DT) So, it maintains its own separate identity clearly. Identity is the wrong word. It is separate independent-ness clearly. (DT) So, that is the reason why we are a transitory in this life. (DT) We came in this world with the terms and conditions that right for us. (DT) Our parents has provided the right condition. (DT) Our consciousness travels through. (DT) Last night I talked that Tibetan endless knot as a chart for the travelling consciousness.

1:12:04.7 And I also talk the genetic chart as a physical beings. I mean the genetic chart is genetic chart. So, nothing more to say. And I’m talking about, I’ve talked about overlapping these two charts. You know, like this endless knot goes like this. So, you have the genetic chart goes through. So, when it is overlapping and it is the point where the physical genes meeting with this travelling consciousness. (DT) So, when these two meets together, then they lock up. (DT) The consciousness will say, “Oh, now I’ve found a new home.” (DT) And somehow, they’re locked in. You cannot get out. Ah. You know, it is very interesting. Funny, you know. The Buddha called this, you know, the locking up business is the genes coming from the father and the mother. It is the locking of semen and egg. And Buddha calls this indestructible drop. (DT) So, indestructible because they will never separate. (DT) If separate, you die. (DT) So, it is called indestructible drop. (DT) So, this travelling mind comes through the point, get the physical gene, occupied, remain in there. And then the physical body becomes unserviceable.

1:15:09.8 (DT)

Translator: Then the physical body become unserviceable?

GR: Unserviceable. (DT) Because it is going to decay. (DT) Getting old and broken and teared up and become rotten. That’s the; you know, that’s the decay. Right? (DT) I think it’s. I call that a manufacturer defect.

Translator: A manufacturer’s defect?

GR: A manufacturer defect?

Translator: Oh yeah. (Dutch)

GR: So, because of that defect, it is not serviceable, so the consciousness separates. Again leaves. (DT) For which we call a death. (DT) So, now. You know, we don’t have to be. We don’t have to be stupid, not to know, the body with or without conscious makes difference. We are not stupid. We all know that. Right? Unless you don’t want to know. Crazy. I wonder that. Say, I don’t know it. (DT) So, which really proves two parts of it. The mind part of it. The physical part of it. And there’s no question. (DT) Honestly. (DT) The physical part of it. It becomes stinky and throw it away. (DT) And the mind part is continuing. Searching for another identity, physical identity. (DT)

1:17:57.6 I mean, it’s always like that. (DT) Now, our difficulty is. Our really true difficulty is, “I don’t think there is a continue, because I never seen anyone coming back. “ (DT) And no one talks about it. Or most importantly, no generally say ever met someone who had come back. There’s no report. There are no document. (DT) But this are our reasons. Neither I’ve seen it, nor I heard about it. There’s no document. (DT) That because our focus is external. We don’t focus inside. We focus outside. We are very good to looking outside. I mean, seeing. Experimenting, seeing what happens. You know, if I mix with red with yellow, what happens? Ah, here comes orange. (DT) But we never does that internally. (DT) That’s why there’s no document. That’s why there’s no report. (DT) So, otherwise. I mean, there’s a report from Buddha. But we don’t believe it. (DT) Because he’s not Caucasian. (DT) I mean, it’s true in the West. If you’re not Caucasian and whatever you record, it’s not right. More or less. (laughs) (DT) Whether, whatever you are. You know. (DT) So, anyway. So. So, that’s way we are. (DT) I do not know if you think it. If you think carefully here. Logically you have established continuation. (DT)

1:21:07.3 If you think that everything is new. There’s nothing before. Nothing after. If you look in the kids. A number of kids brings a lot of memories. (DT) Number of us brings a lot of addictions. (DT) And where does that come from. (DT) We may say, it is an innocent kid. Yes, it’s innocent kid. No doubt about it. But innocent kid is not just begin here. (DT) And that innocent kid has plenty of addictions. (DT) I mean, it’s true. Because these addictions are; they brought from the previous life. (DT) Sometimes they bring the memories from the previous life. And if you see that. If you think. If you recognize that. And if that kid comes from previous life, why not you? (DT) What reason do you have? That’s what it is. Even you look in the belief system. (DT) It is the Judeo-Christian tradition that does not say about the future life. And Buddhism is the one who says about the future life. And the reincarnation. (DT) So, but on the other hand, if you look at, even in the Christian tradition. You’re talking about going to the right side of the God and the wrong side of the God, don’t we? (DT) And who is going? (DT) If you’re not there, who is going? (DT) Think that. (DT)

1:23:57.3 So, I’m quite sure originally in those great traditions, there is incarnation. (DT) Even the word, incarnation itself. Where does that come from? (DT) Right. It’s Latin, right? (DT) Right. In the flesh.

Translator: In the flesh

GR: Right. Right? (DT) Yeah. I mean who enters in what flesh? (DT) So, even in the west. Even you have lapsed for a while. But even then, y4our own traditions. From your own deep religion. From your own culture, you have it. That thing. I mean, think. Who is going to the right or who is going to the wrong? Who is who? (DT) So, absolutely you cannot deny the incarnation. (DT) If you are thinking. (DT) If you are not thinking then, doesn’t matter. (DT) Right. We all know. If you are not using your mind, it doesn’t matter whatever it is. You know. (DT) We as a human being, I mean, such as yourself. You have a beautiful mind. (DT) And why don’t you use it? (DT) Really, a beautiful mind. And a mind that inquires. And raise the question; who, what, where. (DT) And it shows its beauty. (DT) And have to be use it. (DT) I mean, all of you. Really. (DT) So. So, you cannot deny there’s no incarnation. (DT) Then, who is incarnating? (DT) Who else? Other than me. (DT)

1:27:00.6 I mean “me”. Each and every one of us is me. Right? (DT) Are you going to say, “I’m not me.” (DT) No one can say that. It’s me. Right? (DT) Not the ego “me”, but me. (DT) Well, somebody earlier talked about the ego a little bit. I didn’t clarify. Is that you? Not you. Somebody talked ego. Who was it? Somebody might have wanted ego. Who said ego anyway? Somebody must be wanting ego. Do you want ego? (DT) Just kidding. (DT) So. Not the ego. I mean really “me” is reincarnating. (DT) Ego is state of mind. Not a person. Not a being. (DT) Ego by nature is just confused. (DT) And then the fears been add up. (DT) And then sees the sense of urgency and create all kinds of trouble. (DT) We can talk much more but there’s no point. (DT) But actually ego is the source of all our trouble. (DT) We do wrong things because we’re confused. Not because we wanted to be wrong. But we are confused. (DT) Ok. So, when I, when you, when “me” reincarnates. (DT) So, as I said earlier, it’s not new “me” but it is continuation of old me. (DT) So, how does this me now live and function? On what basis? (DT)

1:30:04.4 I mean, it’s almost like, “Who pays for it?” (DT) In western culture. Who pays for it? (DT) What’s your budget? (laughs) (DT) So, then you’re . Then you’re be looking the karma. (DT) Your budget. Your expenses. And your comfort and discomfort and plus minus all your things are from karma. (DT) It is interesting. Before even we talk about this. We have to raise the question, saying “What is karma?” (DT) What kind of an idea do you get, the moment we use the word karma? (DT) We do get. Do you want to say something, 1:31:24.6 Ryaja (?)?

Audience: (Dutch)

Translator: She asked, do you mean if you go to the right or the wrong side of God is there.

GR: Side of what?

Translator: She said, do you mean by going to the right side or the wrong side of God, heaven and hell. And if you go to God, you’re in. But what about the rest?

GR: Well, that’s fine. And who goes to heaven? Who goes to hell? Anyway. Same question. (DT) There must be somebody who has to go. (DT) And who is that somebody.(DT) They’re not pre-selected. If it’s preselected, we don’t have to bother, because it’s not applicable for us. We can write N/A again. (DT)

1:33:01.1 So, it’s not, you can’t write right n/a. It’s applicable for us. (DT) So, if you really think carefully, even that tells you the incarnation. (DT) But if you think of incarnation something what we are here nicely, knowing you. Knowing all of us are going to come back as it is and say, “Hey, how are you? I haven’t seen you for a while.” That doesn’t work at all. That’s not that way at all. (DT) If that’s the case, life is much easier. (DT) We don’t have that difficulties. (DT) But unfortunately doesn’t function that way for us. (DT) But there may be another planet in which they function that way too. It’s not; you cannot rule out. I use the word planet for easy usage. (DT) In the Buddhist tradition we divided this existence into either six or ten realms, they divide. (DT) So, there is something called “god realm”. (DT) It is the small “g” god, not the big capitol “G” God. (DT) So, those who are in the god’s realm are known as three timers. (DT)

Translator: Three timers?

GR: Yeah. The past, present and future time together. (DT) So, it’s they’re not living past, present and future together, but they are seeing everything together. (DT) So, for them yes, “I haven’t seen you for a while. When did you come up here?” You can say that. (DT) But not anywhere else. (DT) We don’t see past and present and future. And that is our limitations. (DT)

1:36:04.4 The spiritual path, practice, individual can go beyond that limit. (DT) So, they’re supposed to see then. (DT) But whether we believe it or not believe it. That’s a different story again. (DT) Right? Anyway. So. So, the sources of life that we sustain, we maintain, we obtain, all our own deeds. (DT) We call that karma. (DT) Karma is nothing but cause and effect. (DT) we see in our lives, we do something good, we get something good. We do something bad, we get something bad. We see this in our life. This is not a mystery. (DT) We bring some violence and get the consequences of violence. We bring non-violence, it has consequences. I mean, result there is non-violence. (DT) And we saw this in the history. We’ve been seeing it today. (DT) There is no mystery about it. (DT) So, really, the cause brings result. Good cause brings good result. And bad cause brings bad result. There is; you don’t need rocket scientist to figure that out. (DT) So, that makes the good karma brings good result. Bad karma brings result. (DT) Now the question comes, “What is good and bad?” That is a different question. (DT) Right? So, how do you know what is good? And how do you know what is bad? (DT) Good for something can be bad for somebody else. (DT)

1:39:05.2 So, where do we draw the line? (DT) You should have some idea. (DT) You want to say something? (DT) You don’t want to say. That’s fine. You don’t have to. I’m not forcing you. Ok? Don’t take pressure. (DT) Ok. What is bad? (DT)

Audience: (Dutch)

Translator: I think the lady over there said, “Well, we could draw a line with the lucidity of the mind. From there you could judge what is wholesome or not wholesome.”

GR: It’s true. (DT) But how do we know? (DT) I like to see this way. (DT) If somebody hurt me, do I like it? (DT) If somebody been nice and kind to me, do I like it? (DT) If someone hurts me and I don’t think it’s good. (DT) Right? It pains me It hurts me. (DT) It become violence. (DT) So, it’s bad. (DT) It’s quite simple. If you hurt anyone, including ourself, I think it fits in the definition of bad. (DT)

1:42:05.7 If we have been nice and kind and didn’t hurt, but been nice, it may fit in the definition of being good. (DT) It is not a coincidence in my opinion when this, you know the Judeo-Christian tradition, they talk about ten commandments. In the Hindu-Buddhist tradition, they talk about the ten virtuous and ten non-virtuous. I don’t think it is coincidence. (DT) Unless Buddha and Moses and those Jesus and all they have telephoned each other and talked and decided and draw the conclusion. (DT) So. But we know they didn’t. (DT) So, when they’re looking in there and when they recognize ten, you know, what not to do, is it everything, is it hurting somebody. (DT) So, it means the definition of good person, don’t hurt others. Don’t hurt yourself. (DT) So, when you don’t hurt anybody else, you don’t have bad karma. (DT) When you hurt somebody, you do have karma. Bad karma. (DT) Alright. A lot of questions. First, Elizabeth.

Elizabeth: What if you inadvertently hurt someone? You don’t intend to do it. You don’t mean to do it. You don’t even know you did it. That’s one question. The other question is: What if by doing good to someone, you are also hurting them or you’re hurting someone else? (DT)

1:45:05.3 Translator: The second one was?

Elizabeth: The second one was, What if by doing good to one person, inadvertently you do harm to another. (DT)

GR: I have an answer for the first question. I don’t mean to do it, is the biggest excuse in the world. (DT) And second inadvertently hurt somebody doing something good. And that is, you have to analyze more. It depends on the action. It depends on how much you hurt. (DT) Can have both. Good and bad can both. (DT) Or can cancel both.

Translator: Cancel?

GR: Cancel the karma. (DT) So, lady over there. Hi. You, you.

Audience: ???

GR: She’s speaking English or what?

Translator: Yes

GR: You’re speaking English. I’m sorry. I thought you are speaking in Dutch so I wasn’t listening. (DT)

Audience: 1:46:45.6 ???

GR: Let’s have the first question deal first. What did you say? Dharma and karma. What happened?

Audience: Are dharma and karma connected? Are they intertwined, as it were?

GR: I tell you a story. I was in the retreat in the upstate New York called Omega. (DT) And it has nice place, and it has a lake and there’s a; there’s a lot of kayaks available. (DT)

1:48:02.5 So, then I took a kayak and went in the river. In the, in the lake. Went far away. (DT) There’s a wonderful Jewish master called. What’s the name? Zalman Schacter. (DT) So, he was in the kayak quite far away. (DT) So, he saw me. So, he come around. And I drove up, I sort of pushed up. And we’d been talking. And while we were talking his. What you call this? Oar. Oar has fall down in the water. And it’s going away. He’s going to the other way. (DT) So, I said, “Oh, you’re losing your oar.” And he grabbed it quickly and he said, “Otherwise I will be karma without dharma.” (laughs) (DT) So, it gives you an idea. Karma is like a lake, ocean. Dharma is the one which you can go in the better direction. (DT) So, your second question. Now, do you remember. (DT) If don’t remember, doesn’t matter. We’ll come back. What happened?

Audience: I think there’s somebody else

GR: I’m sorry

Audience: I want to ask question. We know somebody else is asking

GR: I didn’t get it.

Audience: So, Rimpoche. I want to ask question but somebody else was next.

GR: Oh, no, no. You go ahead.

Audience: If you are talking about good and bad, referring to whether it hurts others as well as yourself. What if you are good to others, but you are not good to yourself?

Translator: Rimpoche, can I translate the question?

GR: Sorry. Yes. (DT) I think it is one of the biggest problem here, in this. In our spiritual world.

1:51:02.0 People have some kind of understanding, that you, ourself, is not worth for it. And nothing. But the, when you talk about compassion, we consider compassion has to be on others. We have to be. We talk about love. We have to think about loving poor and others. (DT) And I think it is some kind of misinformation and misunderstanding. Because the “me” is there. Another human being equally needed all attention. And equally hurting. Equally crying. It’s there. But why should one individual has to suppress “me” and then try to lift up the others. I do not see that. (DT) And beside that, we talk about bodhisattvas. And you know, the person with the compassion and love and all of those .So, they are doing this for the benefit of all others and this and that. We talk about it. But one thing what we’re forgetting is, without helping myself, you cannot help others. And we’re really forgetting that. (DT) You know, the basis of helping others is helping myself. (DT) And if you did not help yourself and you want to help to the others, then you have to say, “How can I help?” (DT)

1:54:06.4 I always make joke with Ram Dass for that. He wrote a book called, How Can I Help. I said, “Because you didn’t help yourself, so you have to say, ‘How can I help?’ “ (DT) Ram Dass is a great person. I mean it’s not that he didn’t help himself. Yeah. But it is joke. (DT) And beside that, if you don’t help yourself, who else going to help you? (DT) I think it is very important. And not to, to sacrifice self. (DT) For sake of others. Honestly if you look at the bodhisattvas. Why the bodhisattva’s doing service for the other people. Benefit of others. (DT) They do this so that themselves can become Buddha. (DT) So, actually there is a self-interest, even in there. (DT) Which is not obvious but nicely hidden. (DT) But every spiritual path is like that. (DT) I mean, it’s all focused towards uplifting one individual. (DT) For that, you’re doing this and that. Right? (DT) Every motivation at the beginning we’ll say, “For the benefit of all beings, I would like to become Buddha. For that I will do this, this, this.” So, it is really tells you. Indirectly tells you that’s how it is. But on the other hand, if you encourage helping yourself, we already have a huge “me”. Me, me, me. So, it becomes ego boosting.

1:57:00.7 So, therefore, I think it is turn around. (DT) I hope I communicated to you.

Audience: Rimpoche. I (???), sometimes during a period of depression, I think (??) when we’re interacting with other people, you’re making a point you don’t hurt them. I’ll still be nice. I think it that. And I find it so difficult to get out of the depression myself. (??) (DT)

GR: The depression. Can we come back and talk about it? I think it is; it is something. I think it’s another big thing here, you know. Because I was already told. Given the signal already for a while to go. (DT)