Archive Result

Soundfile 19900707GRAALR2

Speaker Dagyab Rinpoche, at first in English

with some translation from Tibetan into English by Gelek Rimpoche

At 0:52:56.6-end, mostly translation from German into English,

translator unknown

Location Ann Arbor

Topic Lamrim

Transcriber Janet Bourgon

Date 11/12/2022

0:00:00.0.

From your side, [conversation in an aside with Gelek Rimpoche.].

00:48.5. Gelek Rimpoche: So, the question rises, from when would you say you have equanimity within the individual? The equanimity, this particular equanimity what we are talking about. So when you look at all the sentient beings, and when you sort of generate [1:20.7: Dagyab Rinpoche speaking with Gelek Rimpoche in Tibetan].

2:03.9. Gelek Rimpoche: So, Rinpoche says it's easier way, if you put it that way. When you look in the sentient beings, normally we label them off. We label them off, this is enemy, this is a friend, and this and that. And sort of we label them because of some reason what we have. We label them. But by nature of the person itself, from that point if you look, from the point of the person, from the nature of the person, the person did not establish himself or herself as neither enemy or [2:39.5: no it is their friend.] It is only that we label them because of various obvious reasons. When we can see that clear, we're labeling them because of certain reasons that I label them, but by nature of the being itself, there is no such really exist way of, from their own way as enemy or friend.

3:10.0.

Gelek Rimpoche, continued: Maybe we can say when we clearly get that, [3:51.1: moefit ??] friend, maybe we can say you begin to establish the equanimity over here.

Dagyab Rinpoche: So I always try to keep contact, or put into contact into the, with the, emptiness. So now the way how I explained is slightly connected to the emptiness. I think we can say like this. So somehow, at the same time, you're practicing the emptiness.

And now I'll try speak some, the first cause, which so-called [4:20.8: mar shey ?? Gelek Rimpoche says, 'recognition of the mother being']. Yes, recognition of mother beings.

Gelek Rimpoche: of sentient beings.

Dagyab Rinpoche: So actually [4:40.3: I'ze ??] place. Yes, strike. Or protest. [Laughter]. So the, of course, Buddhist theology or way of thinking is based on Asian mentality. So therefore, in Asian country, the accent of your mother is very, very strong. But on the other hand, the question is accent. Accent? [Audience: emphasis.] Oh, emphasis. Emphasis. Yes. Emphasis, okay. Biologically seen, the mother is very important all of, all the beings, all the beings who were born by [5:59.9: speaking with Gelek Rimpoche] accept wombs and so on. This is a different business.

06:05.0.

I know there is many Western people have problem with mothers. So many daughters and many son don't want see their mothers anymore. Questions arise very, very often. I think maybe here's also more the same, like in Europe. Therefore, for such person, if I teach, if I was try to speak, oh you have to think everybody, every sentient being's like your mother. This is can't be worse. [Laughter.] Yes! So for such person of course one must have a different method.

So as I mentioned, generally speaking, so mothers only nearest, nearest person. We all born through mother, from mother. And the really real relationship between child, between children and mother or parents, have only people who had own children, I think. For instance, before I, before you got children, I can't imagine how can I developed such a relationship to my children. Because up to then, only through the explanation from the other people, I can imagine but I cannot feeling. As soonest we got the child, then you see, you can feel, automatically you can feel. And automatically if you, how you are thinking on your very little baby, and if he's or she's crying.

9:07.4.

Or how your attitude to all time, day and night. For instance, you are in a sitting room talking with many friends, and baby's in the other room. But you are the first person who knows that he or she's crying. The others are, how can you listen? How can you hear, hear like this? You got a tremendous good ear. But that's not true. But instinctive. Somehow the feeling you are feeling toward your children is too strong. So through this feeling, you can hear, or you can feel, all activities in that corner.

So, we pay, or the parents or mother paid such a tremendous attention to their children. But baby can't think about all this, and the baby can't feel at that moment. And now we are grown up, we can only judge. We can't say really what we felt when I was, for what I feel when I was one month. But I can say that my mother paid such attention to me, and how kind she was to me. If she was not there, would I could live? And how much I was dependent to my mother. All this position you must really, through many reasons, many examples, make clear.

Look at the birds. The mothers and father, too, collected worms and put into the small bird's mouth. But if the mother, or if the parents didn't bring such food, what can happened? This is absolutely clear. So the small, the small birds are so much related to their parents. Not only birds, but we all.

12:38.4.

So you can't remember all kindness, all the strength, all the effort from your mother, but this is no problem. This doesn't mean that your mother wasn't kindness and so on. That doesn't mean. So therefore, I will continue afterwards for a little bit. But anyway, therefore you must try to imagine all the attitude between mother and the children. If you don't feel to start with your own mother, you can think about general position. We can see many nice animal films, the relationship between children and their parents. And you can watch to other person and general position and so on. So through this exercise I think you can find certain picture about the relationship between the mother and children. So I think we'll stop just now here and start, continue again after lunch.

[Prayers]

15:01.0.

[Background noise-- microphone got left on.]

15:44.6. [People gathering.]

16:37.1. Dagyab Rinpoche: Things, the recognition of all sentient beings are as mother is one of the difficultest subject to realize, to obtain. Because, as we know, we are so much used to keep distance to many people, and most of sentient beings are for us neutral persons, or neutral beings. The group of our friends is very small, very limited. So maybe this one of the reason why it is too difficult to get into our mind. That means that we, it is difficult to accept all sentient beings as mother.

18:17.7.

So, how is it the technique? Or how you should think that all sentient beings as your mother? Of course, first of all we must understand or we must accept, we have to accept our many different lives. If you don't accept, then it's very difficult to start with the subject. Therefore, first of all we must try to implant [19:18.5: asking Rimpoche about a word in Tibetan] implied that there are many, many previously lives. Can we say like this? Because of my limited knowledge I couldn't well explain about this matter according to prajna paramita, well not prajna, but pramana logic. Logic. But I think these all, the idea of different lives, based on the continuation of our [20:47.2: Tibetan] most subtle consciousness. Yes. Subtle consciousness. [Discussion with Rimpoche about terminology.]

21:03.7.

So anyway, [sept ??] consciousness. For us, between last previous, immediate last existence and this existence, there has been a great change. So therefore we couldn't, generally speaking, we couldn't, one couldn't remember clearly. But if I give a rough or just simple example. From yesterday, between yesterday and today there are some, one certain interaction. Interaction between sleeping, through the sleeping. Through the sleeping. We couldn't remember exactly today what we yesterday did. Of course we could remember many things, but we couldn't remember as clear as yesterday. So one factor why we couldn't remember is maybe interruption through the deep sleep. So day by day, and year by year, if you think, if you recall, we couldn't remember many things for ten years. But we can't say that we don't have, we have any, ten, some happens ten years before.

So all these happenings, so to say, based on subtle consciousness. So what I am going to say is like this, what does it mean 'time'? Under time I understand many things. Time can be mean one hour. Time can be mean one month.

24:08.0.

Just roughly period. But time can mean also one life. Of course you can extend this time from, on the many, many lives. If we are time limited on one year, it doesn't matter whether there are twelve months or thirteen months. We understand this just one.

So for all this, for us it's clear that we are born, that we had a mother, we had a father, and we had this and that, family and all this surround. This is for us more clear. But how it is for me, for us clear? Could we remember our real birth? No. No way. But we believe on the saying after the, so forth mother or father or parents or other relatives. We can't prove that, or I can't really prove that I really born from this mother or that mother by myself. Therefore I must rely on the saying. Unfortunate I couldn't, my explanation was not that clear, but I'm trying to from the various point put altogether. I hope that will be alright for you.

27:01.1.

Our body mind basis of our beings, or existent. It is not possible that our mind existed, exist through the body or external things. Our mental, or our mind must have a same quality as a cause. As a cause. So for instance, my mind what I have today is continuation of yesterday's mind. Yesterday's mind was somehow related to, with my mind that I have today, which I have today. So we can extend from last year and thirteen year and up to my birthday, real birth time. So from there mind of my last, my last existent, must get into this existence mind. Did you understand what I mean? Must joined.

Some body exists through our parents. That's quite clear. We don't need to say it. So mind one couldn't share from our parents. So it must have some particularly cause. That is only way, that means previous mind. So we have a common mind, so called common mind, of this existence and last existence, and then also then before that, and before that, and before that.

30:04.7.

So on the whole we have one mind, which is connected to all these existence, all so many times. Just equal to within one year, so many months. Although many months, but we accept this as one time. Years as a period. So I was, I just want to give a [30:48.5: have a layer ??].

So we have a mother, that's one. And I have one mother in this existence. And I had also one mother the last existence. And I have another mother for the, before that. And therefore, it comes automatically, many, many mothers for together. And my existence, previous existence, was not limited. There many, many kind of existence. So there must have many mothers. And each existence, that means for instance, I was born once a dog. But not only one time, only once, but many times. And dogs in the East, dogs in the West, dog in South, so you can multiply many, many times. So if you think it's very carefully, very thoroughly, then you can find, you can get a feeling, there are no, this is my existences beginningless. Can you say like this? Beginningless? So if it's, if my existence is or was beginningless, I must have countless mothers. Each mother was, generally speaking, same kind to me. Same kind to me.

33:12.4.

So I think this may be enough just give rough idea how we have to think or how we are thinking, or how the idea is. But as I mentioned, for many people it is not that easy to think or to connect with our own mother. So if you have some problems with your mother, it's not necessarily at the beginning start with your mother. But maybe with your father. Maybe with your brothers or sister. Or maybe you have friend, or even some other relatives or friend. So main thing you must have a person who is most dearest for you. That should be. So basically idea the same. If you are taking father as example or your husband or your wife or friends also, this makes a big different. But whether you are get on well with your mother or not, so mother is, as I mentioned this morning, very next person of each of us.

35:59.7.

And after that you have think about the kindness of your mothers or your friends. In the West people are very much enterprising, and they're very much independent. So after thirteen years or by fifteen years, then many children are going on, they leave on their own. And then start to attack to their parents. But in Asian country the, our own, their own parents and grandparents are most important person in the family. So I mean it's not in the, it doesn't mean that Asian mentality must accept in the West society. It doesn't mean. But if you are thinking very carefully, how they are kind, how they're kind to me, how they were kind to me when I was very small, when I was baby. How I was dependent to my mother or parents. Now I can survive by myself. I can do everything by myself without help from my mother or parents. But that time when I was very small, I'm not like this. So this condition, this situation, is something which I shouldn't forget. If I do so, if I forget all the kindness of my mother, then I'm not a good human being.

39:13.0.

I am a bad nature. I have a bad nature. So if I do like this, bad nature, is it good or not? Then I can take another [??], another example. I try to be kind to my children, to my friends, some time, after sometimes, they will hurt me. At that time would I think that this and that peoples are good human beings? What I, what my attitude will be? Sometimes this certain things, way of thinking also, useful to put on this point.

Now I can speak. Now I can read. Now I can compose and there are many things. And of course I learned this and that things from school and from my teacher and so on. But the basic knowledge I got from my mother. When I was a very humble baby, my mother taught me how should I eat, how should I walk. The parents can see very clearly how the children are demanded, and how the parents are give up their own leisure time.

42:08.7.

And again [after geden order ??] by force. [Someone in the audience clarifies, but it's inaudible]. Yes, voluntarily and very happily give up all the facilities and all the leisure time. But I couldn't recognize at that time. But now I can see that my mother and my parent, father, let's say my mother had spent so much time with me and the effort. Okay. I think that's enough. So at the end, on the whole, I can't find more kind than my mother.

So in the Lamrim text it doesn't mentioned, but I think it's also very useful after your meditation on such a point just try [44:19.2: aside in Tibetan with Rimpoche] make a certain resolution. And that now I can understand and now I can recognize all sentient beings as my mother. And this attitude I will try keep my whole life. Yes, I think certain resolution should be necessary.

45:03.0.

And on top of that do prayer and do prayer in terms of: from the Lama Buddha, Buddha's body, [an aside in Tibetan].

Gelek Rimpoche: From the body of the Supreme Field of Merit, who's inseparable than that of Buddha and Lama, and light and liquid follows from the body of Lama and go through your body, and purified all non-virtuous that you have committed from the limitless of the beginning, and particularly any obstacles for develop these particular points, cleared. And also, after clearing and you lay a special kind of basis which can developed proper recognition or realization of this important point, has been laid. The foundation which can develop this particular realization is laid within individual.

[46:56.3: blank section]

47:07.1 Dagyab Rinpoche: So please don't forget particular this point. Now I imagined I connected only with your mother, all sentient beings only with mother, but later on we must add on certain things. So it makes bit slightly different later on.

So now I can recognize all sentient beings as mother. I can recall or I can accept all these sentient beings who are my mother, who are my mother, who are very kind.

48:16.4.

But it's not enough just to accept. This is too passive. So you must do something. You must, can you say payback? Repay. Repay. Yes, you must repay, at least try to repay. I think this point is very much [4:03.1: an aside in Tibetan with Rimpoche] [we must ??]. There is many possibilities to, many possibilities to repay. But the sentient beings, or human beings, are more or less countless. I'm only one. How can I repay to all these beings. This is more or less it's not possible. And what does means repay? Should I give them many material things? Or should I support, or what? The financial support is very secondary thing. One can help them only for a moment, for the moment.

If you support, if you could support from the basic, then it's really support.

51:02.1.

Because the sentient beings need really absolute freedom, absolute happy, and fulfillment of their wishes. This they're desire, what they need. We can't give a support through the material according to their wishes. We can't do this because the main problem is not financial problem or material problem, but mental problem. Mental problem doesn't mean they're [52:05.8: an aside in Tibetan with Rimpoche] internal problem. I don't know what to say.

Gelek Rimpoche: The main problem is their pain from the mind. Did that make sense to you?

Dagyab Rinpoche: So that means the sentient beings are suffering, suffering under the [Sounds like German]

52:56.6. [German translator] They suffer under a compelling force of passions.

[Whispering in Tibetan, or maybe German. Discussing 'under', with an umlaut]

53:44.9. [Dagyab Rinpoche in German].

[German translater] Among sentient beings, among the people, we usually think or they think that they are happy.

54:02.0.

[More German from Rinpoche. The following is a back and forth between Rinpoche in German and the translator in English.] This opinion of being happy now is just a temporary thing. So it does not last. It's nothing [55:04.5: abtenence?? absolute?] And all this seemingly happy situations are in actually causes for later sufferings. We all know that among the sufferings there's three types. So what we need, that is to get liberated from this three types of suffering. So all experiences we got are based on our mental attitudes.

57:04.1.

[Continuation of German followed by English translation.] So to repay this kindness it has to start with little things. So small friendlinesses we show others, they are the first step of we start to repay others kindness. Through my reaction I can give others a feeling of joy and that they also become happy. So if we would that extend to ten people, hundred people, thousand people even, so then their feeling of hatred and anger would be reduced and they will become more friendly and happier. So the more of the defilements we can reduce in others, the more this repaying of the kindness takes actually place. The Lamrim is a topic or system which helps to find the way to what's put out. [1:00:00.6.]

1:00:00.6.

Dagyab Rinpoche: One person, yes. [German alternating with English translation.] So since Lamrim is a a way for one individual to put out, so this has to be extended also to a hundred people, to a thousand people, to all people in order to bring them all to enlightenment. I think it in the sense of activity, of active. If I take it only for myself and see that all others are infinite number, then it seems hardly that I can repay all their kindness because I'm only one and they are so many. But by this way of thinking we broaden our view, and with this also we gain more range of a kind of capacity or including more than just one. So we extend our way of action.

1:03:00.0.

[Continuation of German alternating with English translation.] And I think that come up two questions. How far can I really repay the kindness of others? In how far really others receive something good? I hope because of my previous explanation, that these two questions got answered. To specify the same question: I can sit and meditate for long time and I receive some benefit. But in how far does others get benefit through my service, and how far I really can benefit others? That's the question. If I meditate I can benefit myself, but can I really benefit others through my own activities?

1:05:08.7. Dagyab Rinpoche [in English]: Because there's many people saying that Buddhism is very passive, very passive. You are sitting in a room and and just talking about bodhicitta and meditate, but you can't reach to the sentient beings because sentient beings very wide. That's quite true, but it's not that passive. As I mentioned just now, through my own effort I can reach so much. I can reach boundless wish to repay the all sentient beings.

1:06:09.5.

And I had already equanimity, and I recognize all sentient beings as a mother. So that's all great deal. But the second, to the second question. [Now speaking in German with English translation following.] Mainly through the activities of the collective, that means through many people, can the wishes of all the sentient beings be fulfilled. So if I take a beginner, then with this intention one cannot do very much. But when I see an advanced being like a bodhisattva or so, then through their own inner force, mental force, etc., then I can support many sentient beings which a beginner cannot do.

1:08:56.8.

As ordinary being, often thinks that Buddhism is a passive way, of a passive thing, then that is on a, this is a thing which is on another level. We cannot put the level on which we are, we cannot put that, we cannot measure that one with the level where maybe a bodhisattva is. So on our level maybe it seems that it's of my passive thing. But on a higher level where a bodhisattva is, maybe it seems even its passive, but there is the possibility to be active. [Dagyab Rinpoche in English.] To have such a really deeper understanding, then you must know better about the qualities of the bodhicitta and bodhisattvas.

So all these qualities of course one can explain, but it's not enough. One must have understand how can, how could be function. I think Buddhism is very much based on the mental develop, development, and very much inner, through the inner atmosphere. So therefore it is very difficult, very often quite difficult to make understand, to make understand. As long as you can, [Rinpoche in German, followed by English translation]. As long as we are not able to really comprehend what that means, we can easily misunderstand what Buddhism is.

1:12:05.9.

Through misunderstandings, it's easy to [mis-inter-phrades ??] and then one can say, yeah, that's Buddhism is something with magic and things like that. [Dagyab Rinpoche in English.] So maybe that's enough. And after this point one can do meditate as like before.

Through the past three points one can achieve more or less automatically the fourth point. Fourth point. [Tibetan discussion.] Yes, one can say automatically obtain love to the sentient beings. This is not, I don't think it's necessary to have a special training to obtain this point. So anyway all the attitude of love just like you're feeling toward your very dear daughter or son.

1:15:02.1.

The parents generally speak of course, parents wishes to [switching to German, then the English translation.] Both parents always think the wish that the child has the best. This intention mustn't be intentionally. It can come automatically, or it comes automatically. It's always there when the child is eating or whatever. It's always there. That is an effortless, it's an effortless realization or effortless action. Experience also.

[Rinpoche in German, followed by English translation.] Rimpoche certainly has told already the way of meditating on Lamrim that you go in a procedure. You go through the whole topic, the whole sequence, as an overview, then you face one particular topic and deepen that in a more contemplative way, that you know about this one topic. It's extremely important that one stays as long as one so long on one topic until one has got this kind of effortless realization.

1:18:02.7.

If you only make this overview, then well you know a little bit from everything, but you don't make a deed experience from one actual topic. So you just know a little bit of everything. Lamrim has a certain order, but this does not mean that one only can meditate according this order. Not meditate, but [1:19:21.8: gotten ??] experience. The experience can only come in that sequence, it does not mean that. One can start Lamrim on any points, because every topic in Lamrim is connected with any other points. I think that particular in the West it's important that we are just through the individual's own attitude or own feeling. Often the people have kind of an aversion towards meditating on the hell beings or the realms.

1:21:05.4.

And it's also difficult talking about the student-teacher relationship. About the hell beings, there are different ways of explanation. But I don't know, I don't want to go into more details about other topics in Lamrim, but it's important to have the overview over the topics and going into one of the subjects.

So, next topic is compassion. Compassion, and even more the great compassion, is a very important thing for the development of bodhicitta. In one of the Madhyamika texts of Chandrakirti, [1:23:48.7: Madhyamaka-mula ??], there Chandrakirti instead of making a praise to the Buddhas [oh-sty-va ??] he made a praise to the great compassion, showing the importance of it.

1:24:03.1.

So great compassion at the beginning it is like a seed. And in the middle stage it is like fertilizer and water and sun. And at the end it is like the fruit, the ripened fruit. The great compassion helps us to generate bodhicitta. Therefore great compassion is like a seed. And when one has achieved the bodhicitta, then one starts in the bodhisattva's activities. And because of that it is said it's like the fertilizer or the sun and so on, because it helps to grow. One says that the Buddhas did so countless activities helping others and so on, give teachings and so on. But this was only possible through the impending force of this thing, great compassion.

1:27:08.2.

1:28:10.7. So how do we generate great compassion? That's a big topic. Generating compassion towards somebody or something who is very obviously suffering, like an animal who is going to be slaughtered or so, that is not so difficult. That's quite easy to achieve. Therefore the greatest compassion which can be generated, is that we feel compassion towards the sentient beings because they always have to go again and again and the cycle of samsara.

1:30:01.4.

And this type of compassion, feeling towards that fact, that is the greatest and best way of compassion. In order to get really a fully understanding about the suffering of others going in cycle of existence round and round and round, this understanding I can only gain if I have a proper example on which I can really comprehend it. And that's me. So on myself I have to really comprehend what sufferings [1:31:06.2: side ??] of existence is like and what it means. And based on that I can really generate and get a comprehension what it means for others. If we haven't got the experience of what it means to be caught up in samsara, then there's no point that we can generate the wish and the idea and comprehension what it means for others. So therefore the being fed up with samsara, or the determination to be free, that mean this thing, that is the one side of the thing, and in relation to other sentient beings, it is the compassion. So what we generate for ourselves that we are fed up with samsara, in terms of the other sentient beings, it is compassion that we want them to get out of it.

1:33:02.1.

Therefore we have first look at ourselves... End.