Archive Result

20001108GRNYOTF06

Odyssey to Freedom – November 8, 2000 – Talk regarding Karma

32 Taking refuge

33 Consider: Positive Actions bring Positive Results

34 Consider: Negative actions brings negative Consequences

Note: The mp3 file was out of sequence. Rimpoche begins the weekly talk at 28:30. The first part of the talk begins with the Q & A and Jewel Heart events, which should have been at the end. I will begin at the actual beginning of his talk. In addition, the mp3 file is labeled as 20001102 (6). The actual talk took place on November 8th.

28:40 We are continuing to work on this Odyssey to Freedom and as far as that goes, I just asked people here we did we start, and they told me we’re on thirty-two -Taking Refuge. So, that’s where we are. So, last time I remember vaguely we talked a number of days on the refuge, and qualities of the Buddha, and qualities of the Dharma, qualities of the Sangha. (?) Didn’t we do that, right? So, before you take refuge, we need to know whom we’re taking the refuge. We can say, Buddha is great, but we know nothing about the Buddha, except that everybody says good things about the Buddha. Yeah, really. And no one really ever says anything bad about the Buddha. Maybe, there are somebody who says something bad about the Buddha too, but we don’t hear. So, we thought it’s great because everybody says, “Great!” And that is not good enough to be able to take refuge. 30:00

30:00 So you need to know a little more than that. I think I did a talk, but the bottom line is how do we know that Buddha is great. Because what Buddha said and what do he do and what did he teach. And what did he teach, he taught or his teachings. When that makes positive impact and contribution to our life, today, two thousand five hundred year after the fellow died and still it is making a fantastic contribution to our lives. And that also, with today’s scientific development, with this modern age, when that’s making impact. Each and every one of you who are here of each and every one of you who are listening on this, web-broadcast. Each and every one of you who are doing this, because is makes a difference in your life, it made a contribution to your life, or you hope that is makes a contribution to your life., and that’s why you are here. You are not here just to have fun or curiosity, maybe some curiosity there, but just to have fun we don’t come here to have fun. And if you don’t listen to this to have fun and particularly from Europe, it’s 1:30 in the morning. When you get up at 1:30 in the morning and turn your computer on listing to this or 7:30 in the morning in the Malaysian Singapore area, so we don’t do that just to have fun. So, it is making a difference, helping and contributing to your life. Positive contributions. So that the reasons why Buddha was right and great. Because what he says it made a difference in his life. It is making the same difference in our life, even two thousand five hundred years later. With all those technological developments, with all those modern scientific developments, so that is a valid reason the Buddhas is not just a historical figure. It was a person who made a hell of a difference to millions of people in their life and continues doing and we all are benefiting through this.

33:38 I think that is good reason, one of them. Then there is the traditional reason, that Buddha knows all things and blah, blah, blah, and these are the traditional reasons. They are all there. And personally, we have to think with today’s age and todays idea. And, yet, we should not ignore the traditional things completely either because they make a lot of sense. And sometimes, where and how they present it, maybe slightly outdated. That is with every religion, Eastern or Western tradition and particularly Eastern traditions. They have that problem. And, maybe, Western traditions are not free of that problem either, we all know very well. So, it is very important as time goes, we have to think according to the time, according to the mind of the peoples and with their understanding and with their approach. It is very important we have to think. Yet, we also pick up the word, I believe it was, true to the tradition. Yet, it is gear towards todays thoughts and ideas. So, not only does the old time Buddha knows, all-knowing, awakened state and there is nothing that existed which in not known by the Buddha, and it is almost like the measurement whether it exist or does not exit, so is sort of going and ask Buddha. And so, he says it exists, it exists because he’s knowing all and that’s sort of the traditional way. And that’s how they trinationally they pressed. But today when you look at it, that maybe be true. But he was great because what he did two thousand five hundred years ago and what he said two thousand five hundred years ago still making a positive impact one the people’s lives, whether it is East or West, whether you are educated or uneducated, whether you are traditional or modern. So, it’s a good reason. 37:09

37:09 At least good reason to pay attention, to listen, to observe the ideas and find out if is right for ourselves or not. It is not that anybody, Tibetan Buddhism, particularly, is not necessarily right for everybody. It is right for some people. It may not suit some people. It is all there. So, for ourselves we should at least pay attention to see whether it is suitable to you or whether it will help you. Even if it is suitable and doesn’t help you, to hell with it. Well, why waste time? And one thing we don’t have is time and energy, why waste? If it is helpful and suitable, then why not? I believe that’s the Dharma.

38:40 Technically, when you say Dharma, it looks (like) something else. But reality is, we talk about funny, and I was the last few days in Ann Arbor, I was reading the Bodhicharyavatara and we’re on the chapter on patience, patience chapter and I was reading two sentences. Started looking, started talking and a thought came on my head, whether you talk about the Bodhisattva way of life, or Dharma or Lam Rim, or Odyssey to Freedom or Three Principle of the Path, we have all these beautiful titles, right? So, whatever, Vajrayana, for that matter, initiation Vajrayana and Vajrayana teachings and even to the level of the completion stage and all of those; and you sort of sit back for one minute and pull back and sit back there and what you’re really looking at it, actually what we’re talking about is “How do we live in our life.” That’s exactly what it is. How do we live our life? 40:02

40:02 Some people would like to take it as some sort of mystical point of view and say all kinds of names, meditate or levitate. Or, you know all of them there. And all of that is true too. All of them you may sort of look at them a certain way and truth, really truth is, the bottom-line truth is, actually we’re learning how to live our life. And that’s what it is. That’s why we’re spending years in our education, educating ourselves in the school system, whatever college system or the university system or whatever it is. So, we’re really learning how to contact things, right? And, just like that and entirely we are learning how to live our life. So, I thought about a book of mine that is coming up, “Good Life, Good Death.” It is really a relevant one. It is really a good life; how do we live? I don’t think we had that idea of this and put the title, “Good Life, Good Death,” no. And afterwards in looking back, that what it is. A good life also and not only a life that we’re living now, and it also affect our future life. Today is the time, creation, it is the time for us for creating our tomorrow. So, I am one of the persons that’s believing or rather convinces that we are the one creating our own future. It is no one who produce something over there and here, take it, give it to you. I don’t think so. 42:43

42:43 Absolutely, we create our own future. Good or bad it is our own responsibility. If it is bad, it is your fault! People don’t like to hear that, but it is. If it is a good one, it is your deeds, you deserve it. So, it is true that way, and that’s how we’re making this, and this is how we’re living today. It’s making that. And that also, not so much physical things. Immediately people will think, it’s a moral contract and that is a physical thing. No! It’s not! It is the mind that makes total difference. It is the mind. It is not physical; it is mind. 44:04

44:04 Physical things, contact, only to support mental things. If you manage your mind well, physically, it really doesn’t matter. If you go and kill somebody, then it does matter. Otherwise, it is the mind that is the most important. So, living our life is actually looking into our mind and a) making our life positive; and b) happy. I think these are the two major things. So, Dharma, on the other hand, is some kind of funny thing you may think. The bottom line, it will go to that. That is exactly what it is. That’s why it become the real refuge. The true refuge is Dharma, not Buddha. 45:32

45:32 You know always they give these examples like doctor, medicine. Buddha is like a doctor and Dharma is like medicine. Each one really works. Doctor can help to make it work or cut it, or whatever they have to do to use the right drug or whatever. But actually, really affecting the individual is the medicine. That’s Dharma. So, Dharma becomes the actual refuge. And that also, our self, we take it. It is my responsibility for me. And so that’s for each and every one of us. It is very interesting. Bottom line, it all links up together, I am responsible for me, I shape my own future, my Dharma is (?). My function, that’s it. 47:20

47:20 The Sangha is the support system. That’s supporting. It is support system for the family. And that’s why there’s three, not just one, but three. That’s not one, it’s three, and that’s how it works. A doctor who guides you, the medicine which you take, the support system which will help you. So, it’s right there has to be three. If there is only one, it won’t work. You know it. If there is no doctor and there is a lot of medicine but what do you do with it? No one will know who will give what to whom. So, that’s what you want to find out, what the system is. Right? So, last time we were talking about some individual conversations where (?). So, that’s what it is. So, that’s why there is three objects of refuge and that taking refuge is actually helping yourself. Way, how I can help myself is, I think (?). It is not refuge ceremony. It is not to think where you sit down and fold your hand. It is not the word which you repeat, they’re vows. Vows there are there to set up framework, to give you within a certain range, that’s the vow. That’s what they do. 49:45

49:45 But the real thing is: How do you do that? How do you function in your life, everyday? That’s the most important. One or two little things here, good. Or one or two little things, bad there, doesn’t make that much difference. But, overall, the overall functioning makes a lot of difference. And that’s what taking refuge is, taking yourself, technically, we will rely on and blah, blah, blah. But really, it’s helping yourself. 50:41

50:41 Sort of symbolically, you go and say, Buddha help me.” Buddha says I will help you. But you do value what’s the right thing to do. So, it comes back to you. What I am thinking is very radical part in Buddhism in me. But the reality, if I say it, every Buddhist is going to be angry with me. But the reality really is, you, yourself is your own protector. Though Nagarjuna said that. Your protector is yourself. How can others protect you? That’s what Nagarjuna says. This is one of the outstanding Indian great masters. So, technically, if I said that today, the probably a lot of people will say “He may not be Buddhist.” It really doesn’t matter to me whatever they say. But the reality is, if you really think, you are really taking refuge to Buddha, it sort of turns around and gets to ourselves. So that is the most important. 52:24

52:24 Taking refuge, is really helping ourselves. And the way and how we help is in the principle of karma. That makes me move to the next number in this. Am I right, the next two numbers thirty-three and thirty-four? Karma. It is very interesting when you say karma, it is a strange word. People sometimes get different pictures, you know. To me, what does the word do? The words there are to give you some understanding. Am I right? The purpose of the language is to give you understanding, to communicate. That’s my thinking. So, when you say word “karma,” it should give you some idea in your head. So, we have to work with that. Each and every one of us, will have a different understanding of karma. if you open up a dictionary, most of the dictionaries talk to you about karma, in there. In English language dictionaries, but whatever it may be. But the most important thing is “What does karma mean to me?” 54:23

54:23 You know who can answer that? Yourself. And whatever you think karma mean and what does karma do, is karma reality or fantasy or just a wild crazy idea or what is it. And that question you have to ask yourself and you get your own answer. And then you see whether your answer tell is the answer given by a Buddha. Is it matching or not matching? If it’s matching, you may have the right answer. If it is not matching, you may not have the right answer. Are you with me? 55:24

55:24 That’s how we go. That’s how I learned. When I was a teenager kid, I learned the Tibet system, in the traditional Tibetan, the Tibet system of debate. It is not like the presidential debates here, you know. One makes the one statement, the other makes another statement and no one knows who told the truth. So, it is not like that. The Tibet system, where I was exposed is that my job is to prove that the other person is wrong, no matter wherever it may take it. The other persons job is to prove that I’m wrong, absolutely, no matter, whatever it takes. And, to drag you down there, it will come down, down, down and after a little while will be very practical, very straight forward answer you have to (?) trade. I remember very funny, you know. I don’t know how old I was, maybe sixteen, and I have big pride that I project that I am a great debater, that I learned and know a lot. And I thought that everybody is some sort of doubts here, doubts, doughty, doughs, here. You know for sixteen or seventeen, not more than that, kid. And I went home on a holiday and I had a debate with my father, who was a great incarnate lama, who was also very well learned. But he hasn’t done it (debate) in forty or fifty years like me now. And it started somewhere is the very deep philosophical meaning. Somehow, he brought me, and another teacher, another great master (______________, Rinpoche), two of them together, but mostly debate done by my Father. So somehow brought to me and that deepest subject into the (?) symbola, symbola, symbola and very simple and finally, I landed in place where I have to say, “The abbot of my monastery, Loseling, which has about seven or eight thousand monks. So, I have to say that the abbot has no spirit to work (?). So I have to be making move to be walking around. And that’s how the Tibet makes you, force you to go in that. When you read to that level, now you know you’re wrong. There is no way you can argue, right? That’s what happens. So, I remember that very well. 59:05

59:05 It started at some point of emptiness and compassion, somewhere; and somehow he took it around. It took about two hours and he took me round and round and round. And after that I had to say, the abbot of Loseling has no robe, no letter, he’s a low part of the back. Because you know, you sort of well you’re debating you set certain points, that’s how you do, that’s how it’s here. It is like playing a chess game or something. So, you can’t go anywhere else. At the end you have to say that. I did cry. I remember. I cried; you know. So that’s what it is. So, that point at that level you actually reduce my pride, tremendously. It hurts. Even you’re riding horseback, you feel you’re crawling on the ground somewhere, you know, Way back to the monastery, I am riding horse, but I felt like crawling on the back. Really, it hurts you. But it helps you. So, that’s what the old system of debate does. If you are exceptional, a little crazy guy, nah, nah, nah. but they really bring you with certain rules and you have to say. To me is happens to the abbot of Loseling, but some people have to say I am naked or wearing a wedding dress. You have to say you’re naked. You’re nude standing there. So, that’s how this debate system will prove whether you are right or wrong. And that’s not possible for us, today. It’s not possible. We don’t work that way. So, what is possible for us to seek with these points is whether they prove to that point whether our (?) are telling or not getting one with that. It’s telling. It works well with that. At least is shows you you are not wrong. Otherwise, you never know. Some of these points are so crazy, that you never know. You never know. And that’s why we have so much, what you call this, fakes and so much. Everybody can pretend to be anything. There are so many of them going on in this world today, because there is no good debate system. So, you really cannot openly prove how wrong you are. 62:46

62:46 If such a debate system is available in the West, I don’t think anybody would make that bad big mistake between Gore and Bush. Even though Gore may have multi-personalities, what do you call that, presential debates. Of the three presidential debates he may have three different personalities. Even then, you can’t get beyond the personalities. 63:28

63:28 Anyway, So, I began the idea of karma. What does that mean to you? Most of the people will think, it is a cause-and-effect system, and you settle down to business to this level. That’s not really good enough. So, what is cause and what is effect and how it works. That’s most important. If you don’t know how it works, what is the mechanical system of its working? That is difficult to understand. Difficult to understand. Yet, there are a lot of keys for this, a lot of keys. For example, take anger. What does anger do to the individual? What does hatred do to the individual? There are some of them that are very (?) visit. Very simple. Some of them are very difficult to understand. What does anger do to the individual? That’s easy to understand. It makes you sick in the stomach. It makes you feel miserable. It makes you hate another person. It makes you feel the whole world is to catch you. Catch you, catch me, that’s what anger do. It is quite simple quite (visible) visit. We can see, it hurts. You can also easily see if you are calm and quiet and relax and wonderful and meditating, you will feel good. We will see that, too. These are simple easy ones. 66:08

66:08 There are also difficult ones. But somehow, we begin to see it, if you think. You begin to see it, how negative emotions create our trouble that we experience. You really begin to see it. I tell you; you need to know it. Just don’t buy it because somebody said so. Why? Then ever work we do, it becomes superficial. It’s all superficial. When you know it, then it becomes real. And you are going to help yourself and you’re not going to hurt yourself, unless you are crazy. In that case you belong to the institution. You don’t belong in public society. So, that’s what it is. 67:28

67:28 So that’s what I want you to get some real taste of that system, karmic system. It is easy for me to see, to say that negative karma will bring negative results and negative emotions create negative karma and positive emotions bring positive karma, positive karma brings a good result. It is very easy for me to say that. It is very simple for you to say, yeah, yeah, yeah, it’s true. Very easy. But it is very difficult to get it. If you don’t get it, it won’t help you. It is just like saying, Om Mani Pedme Hum. We said Om Mani Pedme Hum earlier, right? It makes sense to some people, it doesn’t make sense to so many people, either. So just like that, if karma works that way, it doesn’t work. So, that what karma is, all about it. But I want you to know it. Not only as knowledge, I want you to understand; I want you to really get it. I don’t care whether you understand or not, but I want you to get it. If you get it, you will get it, you will have your own salvation. If you don’t get it, no matter whatever you do, it’s all superficial. 69:15

69:15 That’s one of the biggest problems we face, participially among the people who have been with the Dharma a number of years, shall we say, the senior ones. And that is one of the biggest problems because you didn’t get it. And so, it is some sort of a funny way to walking through door. It is some sort of funny way you are walking through the door. It is sort of a half-way breathing system and a half-way recreation, and halfway intellectual and you walk on that sort of thing. Then everything does not become solid. It is sort of like walking on the thin strip, so you may be going fall this way or fall that way. So, that the long-time people do that and that is because you are not convinced here. You haven’t done your homework here. You might have an intellectual understanding, but you didn’t get it. Literally, you didn’t get it. 70:46

70:46 Karma becomes so important. Why? This is the gear where you shift into what gear you are going to go is this. You are going to go in the most important point that of the material world or are you going to go into the spiritual world. This is where the gear is there. So, I think that is good enough for me to mention. So, I want you to really get that. I don’t want you to have intellectual knowledge on that. I want you to get it. And only will you get it if you think about it. When you think about it, what does karma mean to me? And, then expand it. Yes, it is important to read, but also, it is important to think. If you can’t think the reading won’t do that good. Very good. Reading can give you a lot of information, but you got to think. Thinking is meditation. It is really a meditation. So, long before I say anything, will you think about karma. And that’s what it is. Though you have to pick up the various characteristic of karma or whatever it is, principles, like it. Karma is definite. It starts growing. One never meets with the results, if one has not created cause. If one created cause, no matter whatever happens, you are bound to get the results. These are basically the four principles in karma. So, when you are looking at this, one will never meet the result if you have not created cause. Or is you have created cause; you are bound to have the result. 73:31

73:31 If give you the message. The message is: You are responsible for yourself. And that links up with the earlier statement I gave: You are your own protector. And this is a (? value) someway. You are responsible for yourself, nobody else. Nobody else can do anything for you, also. It is only you who can help or harm yourself. Right? If you hurt somebody, you’re going to get hurt. That’s obvious. I forgot the word obvious; it’s a big problem for me. 74:41 Anyway, it is sort of clear, that is you hurt someone you are bound to get hurt. There is no mystery. It is quite straight forward. Even when you think I got away with it, no. I am going to get caught with that, sooner or later. That is the good part of it and the sad part of it. Sadness is this. Because somehow, all the people get caught up in this. One time or another, that is very sad part of this. One will never know. We never know why. We never could understand. Why, because a life capable of one or two lives, one life or two lives taking that in between this cause-and-effect level. And that why we could never understand like it. 76:19

76:19 A few days ago what happened in Texas, can you imagine a mother will kill a child, not possible. But it’s reality. Five, yeah! Not only one child but five of them, one after another. It is not an issue whether she is insane or not sane, that is not the issue I am talking about here. Basically, it’s not possible for a mother to kill a child and think of five. But that’s karma. Unfortunately, she said that karma of giving the life and ending the life, both. When, what did she do? What did they do? You need a Buddha to answer that. Traditionally, that’s what it is. In Buddhas life, they go to Buddha and asked what happened. And Buddha says five lives ago or whatever, says what happen this what happened. That is not the point, the point really, really that what I said, the sadness. This is karma. This is karma. 78:05

78:05 The bad part of it. And there are also a number of good karmas certainly for a number of people. Not only the bad things happening in life, is karma. But good things, also. Even Buddha said. One never meets the results, if one has not created cause. That is true. Then these five kids and the mother had a created cause somewhere. I forget, I don’t remember, there was a story during the Buddha’s lifetime. Don’t take it valid because I don’t know whether it’s a mother, yeah it is mother or father and some enemy of theirs, a king, I’m sorry, I don’t remember clearly whether it was a king, or father or some ministers or something. So, some of the enemy had killed thirty-two of their relations, child, nephews and nieces and all of them. They cut off their head and put it in a box and made a delivery. So, they went to Buddha at that time and asked Buddha what had happened. Why this thing happened? And the Buddha said, “Some kind of ten lifetimes ago (I don’t remember very good so don’t count me on those numbers) but said that thirty-two cows and some butcher chopped off thirty-two cows head and that is the karmic consequences and what happened this time and there was a delivery of thirty-two human heads belonging to their thing. So that is one incident that took place during the Buddhas lifetime. And the Buddha was there to tell what had happened. And, today, we don’t have a Buddha there to tell. 81:00

81:00 But maybe Pat Robinson had told something. Really! There were two guys last night on one of the channels, one was a Christian minister, and one was a Rabbi and tried to tell what had happened. i was sort of falling asleep, I woke up completely and tried to listen. It was a funny thing. So anyway, they are not Buddha. So, let’s put that away. So, that’s karma again. There are a lot of questions about why me. When everything goes wrong, why me. Another thing is, when something goes wrong, not only one, but two or three or four or five, all goes wrong together. When things go right not only one or two or three or four or five all goes successfully. And that is also a part of karma. There is a lot to understand in our life what’s happening through the karma. But the detail is very difficult for us. We can never figure out almost never. But the basic link idea of negative functions causes negative results and positive causes positive results. 83:07

83:07 Anyway, we are responsible for our own self and our own deeds. These are the important things. We have to get it. Well, I have been talking a lot. So, I should stop here and if you people have any questions of anybody want to make any statement or are dying to make any statements, I would like to give you an opportunity (my thought). Okay, first you. Go ahead. 83:53

83:53 I have a question, not a statement. I was wondering if karma, it seems like it continues. So, for example, the women she had some sort of a karma she created the situation where she did this, but won’t her actions continually, you know, create more karma for additional negative sort of atrocities. So, I am wondering if it used up or some sort of a cyclical thing and if so how do you escape from the cycle. 84:40

Rimpoche: That is the biggest question that we deal with it. When we are learning how to live a good, good life, we are really learning how to turn off this continuation. Otherwise, it is exactly, there is no question she really killed those five kids. And as a direct result of that, the five of them will kill her again, and again, and again, and again and again five times at least. And that as a result to continue, that is the sticky spot. That is the tricky part of continuation. And that is how the circle continuing. And that’s how we are not getting out of this suffering. We are not getting to Nirvana. We are stuck in Samsara. That is the key. That is the glue, and this is the circle of continuation is. That is the biggest point. Simply, I killed you, you killed me. If you are settled in that way, it’s not bad. It’s okay, but it doesn’t stop there, it continues. Not only it continues, but you also know the funny thing is, the direct reverse of the mother killing the kid later they kill the mom. That’s not the bad point. The bad point is all of the six of them, might even be seven involved, who know. But all six of those would like to kill later. They have this, you know, itching of killing. That will develop. That’s the worst part. The addiction of killing and that is the worst. Worse than simply paying a life for life, or eye for eye. It is worse than that, is the addiction. That is the bad part of it.

Question: And so, the question is about purification that we do purification to, even if we do purification, that will not stop the…

Rimpoche: Yeah, that is another thing about purification and blah, blah, blah and all of those. The purification purifies but doesn’t get rid of your addiction. Purification simply purifies the negativities, make it lighter or easier or shorter or whatever. But it doesn’t get rid of the addiction. And that is the biggest problem. You know, in the West, some people are purification, purification. Yeah, you keep on purify you keep on laundering in the machine, but purification is one thing. Great, I have nothing against that. It’s wonderful. But the biggest problem is the addiction. The purification does not get all of the addiction at all. You purify what you did today, you can repeat tomorrow, you repeat again. It’s another circle there.

Response: This is actually a response to the other question. I understand that if the mother kills the child, she’s creating the cause to be murdered in the future. But I would have thought the child that’s murder is paying a karmic debt.

Rimpoche: Sure. Both, both. The child that is killed is paying the karmic debt and the mother will pay the debt later. So, is it will continue? The five children will kill her again.

Audience: I am confused that the mother will be killed by someone, but that the kids, why does being killed, make you want to kill?

Rimpoche: Well, because that’s karma. That’s what it is. We’re killed by somebody else, but maybe they get killed by themselves. Because that’s what going to happen for sure.

Audience: I have a question in my own mind, that it relates to concept of free will and karma. If you can stop karma at a certain point from ripening, isn’t that in effect karmically driven? Is your ability to and your opportunity to live a good life and to make the decision to stop it at a certain point, isn’t that karmically driven in a certain point. Isn’t that your karma to stop it. So in essence what is free will. Because if your free will built into the karma surrounding you. Your ability to be your own protector, it seems like that is based on your karma, also.

Rimpoche: True. Free will, I don’t know. It’s something different. Do whatever you want to do, is free will. But your own choice, yes. But the karmic results and karmic consequences is something else. Free will, do whatever you want to do, does not mean you don’t have consequences.

Audience: But isn’t what you do, I mean, your action results in karma, but your action is driven by karma, also. Right?

Rimpoche: Could be, could be. Not necessarily, otherwise you don’t do anything. You do a lot of things. Could be, but not every action is karmically driven either. Because we do a lot of them. We create a lot of new karmas, positive or negative, both. We create that by free choice.

Audience: So, everything has a karmic result as long as you are in this circle of suffering. But …

Rimpoche: But not necessarily karmically rebuilt either. Every action that we take is not necessarily karmic driven either.

Audience: I thought the result, don’t you have positive or negative or neutral karma from your actions?

Rimpoche: Yes, you do. But whatever you did is not necessarily result of another karma. That cannot be. Basically, that doesn’t make sense to me. We do a lot of things without killing karma or creating new karma, tremendous. It’s not very clear. But let’s talk too later more. So now I can see a lot of hands.

Audience: Based on what you just said, then that mother had a choice, or not.

Rimpoche: Yes, she can abstain, or helped before. She definitely has choice. That’s for sure. Even if it’s karmic result. Even then, she had choice.

Audience: But, if karma is definite, when she was driven by karma, to do the act that she did (End of Tape) Go to Beginning of Tape. 94:02 - 00:00 How could she insert choice in that situation?

Rimpoche: She have the karma to kill both, for sure. However, the karma doesn’t have the immediate life now. It can be postponed; it can be cancelled, or it can be neutralized, or all these are possible. These are free choice.

Audience: So how does one cancel or neutralize such a horrible karma?

Rimpoche: Cancelled or neutralized that purification now I can’t see. Purification makes it not able to materialize. I know the next question you’re going to ask. In that case, how is it definite. That is the next question that comes up. The answer for that. These are not new questions. They’ve been asked thousands of times. Yes, thousands of times from Buddha’s time onwards. It definitely means that once the result started giving, nothing can cancel it. You can negate it faster, but otherwise, you can’t stop. That’s what definite means. Free choice, yes. Definitely there. And now if free choice when she asks those questions, the way she put it. But she has choice, definitely have choice. Not to kill, not to hurt. Or hurt or kill. She’s chosen. Even though she may be insane. She may be crazy, but she made a choice. She may not be responsible legally. That’s a different issue. I don’t want to poke my nose in there. We have a legal battle. So legally, whether she has responsibility or not, I have no idea. It is for the lawyers to sort it out and the judges to decide, all for themselves, too. But karmic wise, yes you have choice. She made choice. 3:03

Audience: So how does one cancel or neutralize such a horrible karma?

Audience: What you said was, when I do purification and I think I am purifying for acts I’ve done, then there is more that I need to purify. Did I understand correctly for things I am not even aware that I may be impelled to do, and I have no awareness of. 3:54

Rimpoche: People do that very often, things that I aware, not aware and all of them, you do. What is the advantage of doing that? One purification does not mean you’re purified. Thought it always advise you there, think you’re purified, think you are pure and all of those some kind of omens. 4:21

Rimpoche: People do that very often, things that I aware, not aware and all of them, you do. What is the advantage of doing that? One purification does not mean you’re purified. Thought it always advise you there, think you’re purified, think you are pure and all of those some kind of omens, somehow, we’re all kind of interdependent connected and you said that, and it makes you believe (?) for a minute or so. One purification does not really purify everything. If that’s true, there is no reason why Milarepa has to build a thirteen-story building again and again and again. It is really true, you know. 4:47

Audience: But I think when, at least for me, when I’ve heard things, I am aware of and things that I am not aware of, what you said today is another way of thinking about it, for me. Things, like the children might be impelled to do without having been a victim of something that I might be impelled to do. That they were victims of the murder. So, they were then, is that what you are including as well? 5:24

Rimpoche: I didn’t get you. I’m sorry. I heard you but I didn’t get it. 5:32

Audience: When you say things, I am aware of and things I am not aware of, when one purifies for things that one is aware of as well as things that one is not aware of, does that include, things, for instance where the children of victims, that they may be impelled to kill. Is it that kind of awareness as well, that kind of goodness to that understanding? 6:05

Rimpoche: I don’t know. What I think of aware and not aware, things you remember and acknowledge and things you don’t remember and don’t acknowledge, that’s what I believe that it is. I’m sorry, we didn’t communicate anyway. You know, I think there are a lot of questions about a few other things … 6:40

Audience: Can I ask you, just to finish this whole discussion, just on a practical level. Can I just ask you because everyone’s been circling … 6:49

Rimpoche: You have got the mike anyway 6:50

Audience: I know I never do this, I’m really sorry. No, I was just reading excepts from the book (I believe it is the Odyssey to Freedom). You can do and undo, this relates to karma. I am just using this example of the woman who has already murdered the five children. What can she do now or in future life to change that action is done and we have all committed actions that we regret? I think that in terms that it’s not enough to purify, but yet we have choice, even after the deed is done, I believe. I am looking at something personal in my life about how can I change an action that has already committed. 7:34

Rimpoche: Well, you cannot change this action which you already committed. You can purify it, but what you can make a difference for yourself is in your future life and in this life in future, is try to get rid of that addiction. Try to get rid of that addiction. Addiction for whatever it is. We call it addiction, but the normal language people may say impulse, habits, [Audience: compulsion]. That is what you have to take care of. That will make the difference. And, that is the key. Purification, yes, important, but that’s the key. Impulse or the habit or tendency to repeat, and that has to be taken care of. And that’s what one can do. And that’s where other people can help. That’s the reality I know of. Thank you. 9:12

Rimpoche went on to make a couple of announcements from here till the 28:40 mark, where he begins his talk on Karma. He talked about several teachings, a retreat featuring his book “Good Life, Good Death.” He says that he has learned more in the United States that he did in Tibet or in India, honestly speaking 15:09. In Tibet what I learned intellectual things. In India, what I learned, is the continuation of the linage. And what I learned in America is that “How does that work with one’s life.” How does that work, if you have a background like Tibetan, like me, how does that work? If you are person educated Caucasians, whatever, and how does that work? And I learned much more in here. So, in one way it is the product of sixty years and in Ann Arbor where it is a chapter a day, we put it …16:37 It is almost like it took seven day to create the world in that manner, that’s how it works. 16:45 But when you are really looking back, it is whatever your learned, you know. So, I am looking forward for this Summer Retreat. So, that’s what I like to inform you of, though, in that the reduced rate is ending on the seventh of July. It is both for the initiation as well as the Summer Retreat, it ends Seventh of July. Thank you, Thank you so much. 18:25

Class Ends with the Migstema to the 19:20 mark. Tape runs to 20:00 Rimpoche talks about being away for a while. He’s going to the Netherlands for two or three months. Informational talks about Jewel Heart activities to the 28:40 mark. Administrative Talks about the Netherlands transition of leadership on a voluntary position for two years. Rimpoche will do an interview with Tricycle, Introduction to Tibetan Buddhism. (You can get a copy of this online.) Rimpoche begins at the 28:51 mark - Number 32, Taking refuge.