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19970318GRAABWL09

Side A of tape 32 of 03/18/97

I want to add something to last week’s discussion. We had a question about spirituality and science. I have been given this article here and I am going to read that out:

‘The religion of the future will be a cosmic religion. It should transcend personal gods and avoid dogma and theology, covering both, the natural and the spiritual. It should be based on religious science arising from the experience of all things, natural and spiritual, meaningfully united. Buddhism answers this description. If there is any religion that could cope with modern scientific needs it will be Buddhism.’

Albert Einstein

Last time there was also a question about how to actually go about and take refuge. I hesitated to answer it at the time, but when you take refuge to Buddha, Dharma and Sangha, the question really rises, ‘Why is there a need for refuge at all?’ I guess we have to know exactly and precisely how to take refuge but first we need to know why it is necessary. Each and every individual person has to come up with the answer for themselves. I can’t just let you look up in the air and wait for an answer, but you can arrive at it on the basis of a certain understanding. So I have to give you the reasons. I have to give you the criteria. I have to tell you what I think. That is necessary and then you can think whatever you want to think.

If I ask myself the question, ‘Do I need a refuge?’, the conclusion is, ‘Yes, I do.’ Why? Because I am not sure where I am going to be reborn. You never know. When we look at ourselves, there is a tremendous amount of negative as well as positive karma within each one of us. No matter how much you may say that you are working with karma, that is not going to be finished soon. There is a tremendous amount of countless karmas. When we die, we are going to die anyway, no matter whatever we do, we have to die. There is no question. When we die, what is going to happen? Nobody really knows. But, if there is such a thing called ‘reincarnation’ - for which we have to give ourselves at least the benefit of the doubt - we will start wondering what is going to happen to us. There is no certainty that we are going to link to a positive karma by ourselves. There is no guarantee. Particularly, if we die with anger, the chances are much greater [to connect to negative karma]. Normally, we get very angry with ourselves, with the whole world, with all the conditions. Especially, if you have some kind of chronic disease, from which you are not going to get better, you will be very upset and will raise the question, ‘Why me?’ We never ask, ‘Why not me?’. So we get very angry. No matter whoever talks to us, we will be angry. That is a strong possibility.

Another possibility is the attachment: ‘I can’t let go of my friends, my business, etc.’ We may think, ‘What about my responsibilities? I have not done this, I have not done that, and this is what I still have to do. I have not finished it.’ Actually it is attachment at that moment. We are attached to living, to working.

Then there is jealousy. So when you look with an open mind what kind of mindstream we are going to have when we die, the possibility is very strong that we will be influenced by either hatred, anger, jealousy or attachment. Think about that. That possibility is there, more so than the chances of ourselves thinking, ‘It is nice and wonderful. I am ready to go. Good-bye everybody!’ That is very rare.

Our friend Mrs. Yutok from Cleveland was saying, ‘It is time for me to die.’ She went to Seattle for two, three months, because her children were there. She thought she was going to die there. She was ready. But now she is not dying. She is still there. She knew there was something wrong with her and they took her to the doctor who said, ‘There is nothing wrong.’ After a while they found that she has stomach cancer, but they are not telling her. So she is still waiting.

Somebody also told me about a grandmother who said she was going to die soon. However, she continued to live for another thirty years.

Normally, people don’t go readily and easily, but there are all sorts of problems. The possibility of our mindstream linking with negative karma is very strong. When you see the chances what is going to happen, there is not so much you can really do. When you cannot really do much by yourself, you look around and get the answer: Buddha, Dharma and Sangha. They are reliable objects of refuge. You may say, ‘Why Buddha? Why not somebody else?’ There are many reasons, but the most important reason is that Buddha is not like any other deity or yidam, but is another human being, just like ourselves. He was born as human being with all the neuroses and problems. He saw these problems himself, found the way out and he did get himself free from all these fears. Since he got himself free, he knew the way. He had the knowledge, the wisdom of experience of getting free from the things we are stuck with - our neuroses. We have mental and emotional neuroses. Buddha found the way out of that. Buddhism is nothing but Buddha’s personal experience which he shared with people, explaining these problems to us, telling us, ‘These are the problems, do not deny they are there. Work with the problems. I too experienced these problems and tried different things. I tried this and it did not work, I tried that and that did work. You can do the same thing.’

So for one, Buddha got himself free and secondly, he shared his path with whomsoever was interested. It did not matter whether the person was rich or poor, young or old, male or female, beautiful or ugly. Without any restrictions and reservations, without closeness or distance, he shared his experience. When Buddha had the opportunity, he helped, and that did not depend on whether that person had committed themselves to do something for Buddha. It did not matter whether you paid or not.

These are the most important reasons why Buddha [is a suitable object of refuge]. Buddha is also like a doctor. Dharma is medicine. The medicine that you get goes into your bloodstream and works against the bacteria or virus or whatever. Then the person gets better. Likewise, Buddha shared his experience and that goes through ourselves. It gets inside of us. We hear and read about the information, we take that in, we think and analyze, we digest and then it works and goes through our mindstream. It works from inside our mindstream. It works against our neuroses. That is how Dharma works. You know that. It should not go like this, ‘Oh, it is Tuesday night. Where is my note book?’ That sort of thing does not really work. Dharma really means that you get the information, think, analyze, think very critically - always - . If you look critically, you will benefit. If you just think, ‘Ha, Buddha, Dharma, Sangha, how wonderful it is, everything is very nice!’, that is the love and light business. That is not capable of delivering anything. You float on the clouds and everything is nice and wonderful. This is only as good as taking hashish. You are high for some time, that is it. When that effect is over, then it is over. That does not work. So you must always look critically. Looking critically will benefit you, and not only you, but the benefit will extend in case you have the opportunity to share that with others in future. The critical way of looking will help you much more than love and light. You have to ask questions. Take it in, eat it, digest it. Then it will work within you, like the medicine works within your bloodstream. It works like that. Your anger is in there, your attachment is in there, your hatred is in there.

I tell you one thing: If you don’t take the Dharma medicine in, if you try to work with anger then, you will think, ‘I am angry, I am upset, I should not be. He has his rights, I have my rights, I should not be like this, I must think in a nice way.’ Every time it happens, that is how you control your anger. Or you think, ‘If I show my temper, it will be embarrassing, I better don’t show it and pretend that I am not angry.’ In America not many people do it that way, but in Asia they do. You can’t show your temper, so you keep on laughing. You just sit there and laugh. That way the other person does not know that you are angry and you are better off. On the other hand, if next time the other person is laughing, you also will not know whether they are really laughing or whether they are angry. So that is how we normally would deal with anger. That is because you [only] heard about it and are concerned with the external effect.

But when you digest the Dharma information, it works within your mindstream. Automatically, when you begin to get irritated and angry, your thoughts will say, ‘Hey, anger is rising. I should not do that. It is expensive for me. It is not good for me and not good for anybody.’ So there is an internal protection inside yourself. That way you are protected. That is a big difference from thinking, ‘I should not get angry. I tried but I could not control myself. I lost it.’ There is a difference. Can you see it? There is a big difference between Dharma working within you and how it protects you from anger, attachment, hatred, jealousy, and the simple knowledge that one should not get angry and trying one’s best not to get angry. The protection from inside can protect you much better than just thinking, ‘I should not lose my temper. It is not good. I try my best to hold my temper back.’ Internal experience is much better. If you don’t get what the difference is, perhaps then you have to experience it for yourself.

Aud1: I think you can also go through a phase where you half try not to be angry and half you understand how the process functions and in this way protect yourself.

R: First you have to learn the Dharma and then apply it. Learning is the only weapon we have. Just because somebody said so, just because it is written in some book, it doesn’t mean that it is the correct information. That is why I have emphasized that you should take any information in very critically. You should know that there are a lot of wrong things out there and with that attitude read and look. Once you have done that, you will raise a lot of questions. There will be opportunity to raise questions. Then you can convince yourself. Once you have been able to do that, it will stick with you and then it will begin to work within you. The purpose of that is that it should work against our neuroses and it will work - as long as you can take it in. If you cannot take it in, you cannot apply it. So first you take in the intellectual information and work with that. After a while you digest it and then it hopefully will work. All the spiritual development is like that. Everything has to go inside and work within yourself from inside. It does not work from outside in. First it goes inside and from within it works. It is just like taking medicine. That is why Buddha said that Dharma is like medicine. So the actual help you get from Dharma, not from Buddha. Buddha is simply a guide, like a doctor who tells you to take this or that pill or go to have an operation.

When you take refuge to Buddha, you are saying, ‘Look Buddha, I am afraid I am getting into one of those negative moods and I may die at that time and it may link with some negative karma and I may be a porcupine in my next life. I need protection and so I have come to you. Can you give me something?’ Then Buddha says, ‘Yes, you are responsible for your own deeds. Your karma is your Dharma, your Dharma is your karma. So if you work hard I can guarantee that you will not be born as a porcupine. ’Really true. The assurance you get from the refuge is totally subject to how you follow it up. You have to follow the advice they give you. So Buddha can do nothing, except show you the way and share the path with you. And if you follow that, Buddha says that he can guarantee that you will not be reborn as a porcupine. The refuge assurance is subject to following the advice.

In Tibetan going for refuge is kyab su chi or kyab su dro. Kyab means seeking protection. chi or dro means ‘I go along with you’. So it means ‘I rely on you, I follow what you say, I go along with that. Can you guarantee I will be protected?’ Then the reply of Buddha, Dharma and Sangha is ,’If you follow exactly, it is guaranteed, because it is your own guarantee. You are responsible for your own deeds, therefore you have your own assurance and guarantee.

With the Dharma, the spiritual development of the person, it is similar. You say, ‘Would you be my medicine and work against my chronic disease such as my anger, hatred, jealousy, attachment etc. ? Will you be my medicine, can I eat you? [laughs]. Will you work inside me?’ That is how you take refuge in Dharma - like a faithful patient, who takes his regular medication on time.

To the Sangha you say, ‘Look, I am following this path now. Would you help me and make sure that I am on the right track? If I am getting off, can you help me to push me back on? If I am held back by my laziness, would you give me a kick in the backside, so that I move forward? If I am going too fast, could you slow me down a little bit and make sure that I move at the right speed, so that I don’t crash somewhere? If I become too emotional, could you help me so that I become stable?’ That is how you work with the sangha. That is the sangha’s job. If the person has become very emotional and is crying, screaming, yelling, with shaking body, there is not much hope at all. People do that a lot, but at that point you cannot do very much, just tell stories, make some jokes and maybe go for dinner. You can’t do much, because this is an extreme emotional state. You are either too high or too low. At that moment it doesn’t work. As we very well know: when you are really angry, you cannot do much [to analyze and reduce the anger], when you are very much attached you can do nothing, you are blind. Just like that, if you are too extreme with any of the emotions, it does not work much. So the Sangha’s job is to make you steady, stable and careful. Whatever you do, do it very steady, nicely, slowly and stable. That is the way to go. If you try to run very fast like the Dixie Express, you will just crash. For sure.

A lot of people will do that. They will think, ‘There is so much I have to do.’ They give up everything else, try to push themselves so much, but that way they are not going to get anything. However, when you are completely relaxed and just sit there, doing nothing, that will not get you anywhere either. You can sit there and wait until the cows come home, nothing will happen. You have to have constant effort, not too much, not too little. That always works. You have to find that for yourself and the Sangha helps with that. That is how you take refuge with Sangha.

Perhaps that answers the question from earlier on, ‘How exactly do I take refuge in Buddha, Dharma and Sangha’.

Now we are reaching to the actual purification.

Verse twenty-seven

With folded hands I beseech

The Buddhas and Bodhisattvas

Who possess the great compassion

And reside in all directions.

First is the subject or object with which we are doing the purification. We don’t just say, ‘Hey, purify all my negativities!’, without talking to anyone. We are not simply yelling. So you have to talk to somebody. In this case it is the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas of all directions. There is not just some Buddhas in the east, west, south and north, but it is the countless enlightened beings who are in the countless universes, wherever they are. You can draw their attention, even though you may not have the power to get to them. But they have the power to hear what we are crying for. Especially, when we want to purify and cry and shout, they will definitely hear us. That is why we are addressing all the enlightened beings in all universes.

These Buddhas and Bodhisattvas have committed themselves to helping all sentient beings. They have great compassion. This compassion makes no distinctions between sentient beings, whether they are close or distant to them. It does not matter whether they are friends or enemies. From the point of view of somebody with great compassion, there is no difference between somebody who is a friend and somebody who is an enemy. Therefore we address the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas as ‘Those with great compassion’.

A lot of people have compassion, but there are only few with great compassion. There are not many people for whom it does not make a difference whether they are dealing with an enemy or a friend from the point of view of compassion which is sorry for them all in the same way. It is very hard for us to get that. If our enemies are in a bit of trouble, we are very happy and want them to have a little more trouble. We may even say that they deserve it. That is a clear sign that we don’t have great compassion. That is the basic human nature. The persons with great compassion look at people, whether enemy or friend, as human beings who try to get some joy or perfection or a better life for themselves. Maybe they are just trying to survive, or getting a little more comfortable. But what they are really seeking is some joy and happiness. That is why they are going through with their harshness and fighting and meanness. They try to gain something. Their deep desire is to find some more comfort. That is the same with your friend. From the point of view of motivation, if you really look at them, most of them try to improve their lives. That is their main motivation. The Bodhisattvas look from that angle. They don’t think, ‘Oh, this person said this to me last year. I cannot forget that.’ This is not the Bodhisattva way.

When we try to draw the attention of the enlightened beings - no matter whether we have been good or bad, kind or mean - for them there is not difference. They are hearing us, we can draw their attention. So we are drawing their attention from all directions. These are the people we talk to. The text says,

With folded hands I beseech the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas

end of side A of tape 32

side B of tape 32 of 03/18/97

The way you do that is with respect for the enlightened beings. You are not saying, ‘If you don’t listen to me, I am going to leave tomorrow’. Giving respect to the enlightened beings is not a bad thing to do. If you give them respect you get that respect back. The traditional body gesture of giving respect in Indian culture is with folded hands. That is why the Dalai Lama is running around folding his hands for everybody. It is the Bodhisattva’s gesture. Mahatma Ghandi did the same thing. You always saw him with folded hands. Did you notice that on all his pictures he is there with folded hands? It is the traditional Indian gesture of respect. In the American system you look the other person openly in the eye and give them a good hand shake rather than doing something funny like this [folding your hands].

You approach the enlightened beings with a nice gesture which pleases other persons. That is also important. People connect with people. Enlightened and non-enlightened connect with each other. When we contact and see each other, it is also very important to do that with a nice gesture.

Allen Ginsberg told me that when he wrote his famous poem ‘Howl’, around that period, he used to run around in something that almost looked like the Indian saddhus’ dress. Trungpa Rinpoche refused to let him in, did not let him come into his presence at all. He told him, ‘You can’t come in dressed like this!’ He made him put on a suit and tie. Later Allen asked him why he had done that and Trungpa said, ‘When you look nice, people will treat you better. They will think you are a human being, not some crazy poet.’ Since then Allen has this tie which he still owns today. It makes a difference if you are presentable to others. You may think ‘It does not matter how I look and how I sit, I am just going to say what I want to say and then it is up to them.’ True, it is up to them, but when you say it nicely and respectfully, you can get $150 more. [laughs]. When you make yourself presentable, your presence pleases them. This is very important. You may overlook that. But if your presence pleases the other person, it is very hard for that other person to say ‘No’ to you. If your presence makes them miserable, then it is easy for them to say ‘No, get lost!’ This is exactly how it works. That is why it is emphasized to have the right gesture, the physical appearance and presentation. Communication is the main thing. When you talk to each other, when you have a nice, presentable atmosphere, the communication works better. Is that true or not? Think from your personal experience. If you are going to go for a job interview, and you have your hair all messed up, the chances of not getting the job are ninety per cent. Your own personal appearance has cut you down. Then if you are in an interview and the interviewers tell you that they want you to do things in a particular way and if you tell them, ‘No, I would rather do it that way’, this is another thing that cuts you down.

Making yourself presentable is important not only in front of the enlightened beings, but in your daily practice and daily life too. Even if you only spend time in your own bedroom and you can smell your own smell just by yourself alone, even then, don’t forget, you are dealing with the enlightened beings, so there should not be any toe jams(?) - really true. So you make yourself presentable. I am not saying that you have to wear a three-piece suit, but you have to make yourself presentable. That is included in the gesture of folded hands. It is good to have folded hands, but at the same time it should not be dirty, smelly hands that you are folding. That may not work.

Verse twenty-eight

Throughout beginningless cyclic existence

In this life and in others,

Unknowingly I committed evil deeds

And ordered them to be done (by others).

Once you have made yourself presentable, they like you and you have their attention. So now you can talk about the subject you really need to talk to them about. You are saying to them, ‘Look, my job now is to purify. What I have to purify is the unlimited negativities that I have accumulated since God knows when, right from the beginning. From the limitless beginning, day after day, month after month, year after year, life after life, through the influence of negative emotions and without knowing what is right and wrong, ignorant of knowing how good and bad karma works, I almost behaved like an animal.’

In one way we say that animals are nice and wonderful, but they are animals. They fight and eat each other. They try to kill each other. The most important sufferings the animals have is the fear of being eaten by other animals. We enjoy watching them, but if you really look at the animals’ behavior you see that they are eating each other. They destroy each other. The powerful ones bully the weaker ones. That is how their nature makes them. I am sorry to say that. There are many animal lovers who may not like what I am saying. As living beings they have a naturally nice part in their nature, but they don’t show it. When they rough each other up, they don’t show the nice part. They are always hungry, looking for food, feeding themselves and their offspring. Thats what they do. That is the difference between us humans and the animals. Although we may show the cold shoulder, we don’t go to the extremes that the animals do. However, when our anger, hatred and attachment arise, then we behave like them. That is why this commentary says particularly that we often behave like animals. We have done that right from the limitless beginning or have made others do it. So we have so many negativities.

Verse twenty-nine

Overwhelmed by the deceptions of ignorance

I rejoiced in what was done,

But now seeing these mistakes

From my heart I declare them to the Buddhas.

You think, ‘I have behaved and functioned in that way, because I did not know better.’ That is the ignorance. We say that ignorance is the root of all negativities. We thought in order to protect ourselves we could get angry. We attacked other beings. We thought we were just protecting ourselves. Most acts of anger are because of that, unless somebody is doing that for a living. Animals do it that way too. Propelled by negative thoughts they do naturally non-virtuous things. You have to think, ‘Who did it and why, what and how was it done?’

You think, ‘Who did it? I did.

Why? because of the negative emotions. I did not know better.

What did I do? I hurt other beings for the sake of my own little comfort I hurt others physically, emotionally, mentally. That is why it is called negative. It hurts, it causes pain to others.

How did I do it? Through my body, speech and thoughts, either by myself or I made others do it. I have been influenced by ignorance, so not only did I do these things myself, but I made others do them, and then I rejoiced.

Now I see that this was wrong. I realize it, so from the bottom of my heart, through the means of the four powers, I regret that and am requesting you to help me to purify.’ That is how you do your purification.

You have to remember the application of the four powers, whether you practice sutra or tantra, Hinayana or Mahayana. This is the principle. The four powers are completely involved in here and we will talk about this next time.

Aud: 1: Regarding the question on faith from earlier on, isn’t the reason and the reward for continuing the practice the path itself, is not doing it worth it just for the purpose of doing it? Is it even necessary to have the notion of California being the goal or would it not be enough to do the travelling? In other words, do you really need faith in a final goal? Is it not enough to just improve from where you are? Do I have to believe that anybody has got to the final goal whatever that is?

R: Aura, would you like to respond to that, since it came out of your comments from last week?

Aura: There are various parts to that question and I want to really respond to the main one. I think that there is a lot of ways to cut up the pie here. In a lot of teachings it says that faith is the mother. Reason and analysis, etc. is the father. So without faith, nothing can be born. One way to look at it, coming in from that angle, is that faith is absolutely necessary. In the example that I gave, however, with the map maker who shows you a map and you trust him as a reliable map maker, and then start your journey, the faith you have is not a blind faith. It is based on some kind of analysis and on a recognition that there is somebody who has on this subject a different level of insight and understanding, because they have investigated further than you have and gotten further than you have and now they are sharing that information with you. The reason why I gave that example was actually to show the combination of faith and reason. One without the other, faith without reason or vice versa, are capable of delivering quite a lot, but my own sense is that in the combination of the two you get the more powerful momentum within your own mindstream. So individually, you certainly cannot dismiss either faith or reason as useless, as if nothing could come from them.

You might know the example of the woman who received a relic believing it was the Buddha’s tooth and prayed to it and got results even though it was actually just a dog’s tooth. There is a lot of examples in the tradition how powerful faith is and on the other hand how powerful analysis is. Personally, I think faith without doubt is very weak. It will not withstand any kind of analysis. That is why I said that faith with analysis or discrimination is powerful, because you don’t fear that because your faith is so fragile, you don’t dare to look at it and analyze it and then you would not question things. The whole essence of the path is to continuously question yourself and the very nature of your view on things.

The other part of your question was: Is it its own reward to just do it, without expectation of reaching a goal, right? I think if you don’t get the reward of the practice itself, you won’t hold out for any goal. If practising does not bring about any sense of development within you, then the idea of holding out until enlightenment is not going to work. So the path is its own reward. However, I don’t see that as separate from the path having some sense of intention.

Aud1: It is said that once you are on the path, you can never be off it.

Aura: You can say that.

Aud2: Is there a different quality to the regret that I have for a specific thing that I did in this life and know about and having regret for all sorts of possible things that I might have done in previous lives? I am clueless.

R: You are right. When you are dealing with things that you know, that is very strong. The other things [from previous lives] you regret too, but it is not that strong, because you don’t know what you did and what to be sorry for. It is not really very clear. However, we are - where possible - specific, and in other cases, generalizing. You are just saying that you regret anything that you might have done wrong. It is in order so that this spot is not left blank. The spot has been filled. That is all we can do.

But the major point of regret is not for the sake of regret at all, nor is it for the sake of feeling guilt. The major point is making changes in ourselves. Lets say I like to do some little, petty thing, for example shoplifting. When nobody is watching, I pick up an extra piece of butter in the supermarket - or an extra can of coca cola. When the machine is not working, I kick the machine and the can falls down and I take it. Things like that - sometimes you don’t mind doing it. You are happy to get that extra coke, which is wrong of course. Now the regret will change that.

In case of lying for example, the purpose of the regret is to get you to realize, ‘I did tell a white lie. That did not do any good. I will not tell a lie any more.’ Likewise, anything which you are not supposed to do you have to train yourself to change that attitude. That is the main point of the regret. It is not a harsh regret that brings sadness and helplessness to the heart. The point is to make a change in the individual’s life. You are saying, ‘I did this and that, and it was wrong and I am not going to do it again.’ But you will repeat! Why? Because we are helpless, we are addicted to habitual patterns. But it does not matter. Don’t let it go by itself, You can say, ‘Oh my God, I did it again, I should not do it, I will not do it, I will not do it, I will regret.’ Still you will repeat. After repeatedly going through that process, then once you get used to it, even though you think that you can never do it, you will be able to do it. That is how you change yourself. Regret really works. It is like there are four holes which we have to fill up. These are the four powers. So we have to fill up the hole of regret, telling ourselves, ‘This is not good, I will not do it again.’ Otherwise we will keep on doing these things on an on. This is because we are comfortable with it. We may think, ‘This is just my way of doing it.’ But that does not improve the individual. So the main job of the regret is not that you feel sorry and cry and feel helpless and hopeless, but the point is that you change.

With actions in previous lives we don’t know, so there is no way to get real strong regret there, but both go together and so you fill up the hole and change yourself. You are not taking a chance of leaving anything out, so you do both together, purify the things you know and those you don’t know.

Aud3: So is it really possible to purify things from previous lives that way? For example, if I have done some shoplifting, do I say to myself, ‘I regret that and I want to purify also every other instance of shoplifting from any other previous life?

R: What I am saying is different. I am saying, ‘This thing and that thing I regret. There must also be a lot of things which I don’t remember. I am not taking any chances of leaving these unpurified. So I regret all of them.’ As a lawyer, you will know how to write documents: everything must be covered, no holes unplugged. You don’t want to make yourself feel bad or punish yourself or make yourself vulnerable, hopeless and helpless. The purpose of regret, again, is to change the way how you function, how you do things. It is like when a not so nice person is with a nice person day after day. When the not so nice person sees that the nice person is doing things this way and that way, he begins to see himself doing things a little bit wrong and he will start thinking, ‘Well, I should not be so cunning, I should not be so manipulative, etc.’ And that will change the behavior.

Aud4: Is all anger harmful or is there such a thing as useful anger?

R: The good old question. If you can fight with the pillow, that is okay. Some people will say ,’Anger is good, because you can get things off your chest, out of your system.’ My personal view is: All anger is bad. Period. People may feel good and relieved after they have yelled and screamed. You have let it go. But that is stupidity. Really true. After using such a strong word I have to give you the reasons. The simple reason is that anger is extremely expensive. Even a second of anger can burn up hundreds of eons of positive karma. Therefore it is terrible. The little feeling of relief that you can get from the anger bursting out is not worth the expense you pay for it. You can get the same release by running. You can run outside into the cold, rainy weather. If you can run out there for three miles and back without getting angry, you will feel the same old feeling of release. You can do exercise and jog and get the same feeling of release without depending on anger .You can also throw a bucket of cold water over your body - you will get the same release. [laughs]. It is better. It is not so expensive.

Aud5: But sometime recently you said that anger is wishing harm on someone and just feeling frustrated is not so bad?

R: I can see that you are a lawyer. You catch my words and you have caught me out with your cross exam. [laughs]. Yes, I did say that. Mere frustration may not be angry at all. There is the possibility of getting angry. But anger really has a desire of harming others, whether others or yourself. Simple frustration might not be anger at all.

end of side B of tape 32