Archive Result

;;1Soundfile 19970504GRJHNLWID04

Speaker Gelek Rimpoche

Location Jewel Heart Netherlands

Topic Working on Inner Growth

Transcriber Vicki Cahill

Date February 9, 2022

So, I hope everybody has a nice sleep last night. Lama Pema: To, to debate with the Tibetan teacher. The reason is because in the first line of the writing he says, 0:00:12.6 (Tibetan: she je tam che su be chen pa) Means, the one who has wide eyes sees everything. So, that really provoked everybody else. Who can see everything? And they basically say, “Who’s that? Who knows everything, who’s omniscient?” So, they came up and started to. All they enter Tibet and then started the debate in the place called 0:00:40.6 Mahalangur Chitwan, right below the, right behind the Nepalese border actually. Right behind the Everest. And there the debate took place and they were defeated. And later they renounced their system and became monk. And until recently, until 1959, their hairs, when they cut off their hairs to become monk were still preserved in the Sakya monastery in Tibet as the proof of that.

(DT) And did you get opportunity to think a little bit what we talked? (DT) Anybody have any thoughts what we talked yesterday needs to clarify a little bit more? (DT)

Translator: in the corner

GR: Where? Oh yes.

Audience 1: And I wanted, why is this necessary? To. I don’t think we talked about yesterday. 0:01:15.8 (?) Good American luck (?) and what it adds to it to believe or want to believe the further (?) on which this is based. (DT)

GR: That’s a very good question for me. Because that way I can link very easily in the next 0:02:13.4 in (?). (DT) This is true. The life what we have is good It is not only good, it is very precious. (DT) It is precious because you can do anything you want to. (DT)

0:03:13.5 Do you think so or not? (DT) Yeah. You can do anything what you want to in this life. Huh? Yes. Potential. Sure. Everyone from the life’s point of view. Everyone has capacity what they want to do. No question. You. We call it scientific development today. Materially. Right? Scientific development, right? Who are those scientists? Let’s look at Einstein. What is he? What was he? A human being. He may be genius, but he was human being and he’s not a god. At least, I hope he’s not.(laughs) Hope he’s not. But it is human being. I’m sorry. (DT) Ok. A human being could achieve that. So, the scientific achievements. What we call it. Hi Barbara. Scientific achievements, what we call today is the human achievement. And who was Buddha? And who was Jesus? Mozart? They’re all human beings. (DT)

0:06:01.0 Marian Van Der Horst is right. In one way, she’s thinking, everybody cannot do everything. It’s also true. Everybody cannot become good painter like you. (DT) Yet .But. You could become great painter. (DT) You did. You are.(DT) So, that’s because you are human being.(DT) If you’re a dog and no matter how intelligent you may be, you will not be able to paint this, at all. (Laughs) (DT) You may put a couple of paw prints here. (laughs) That’s all bark. If you are a dog.(DT) Since you are human being, you could do this. (DT) So, that is. That may be your achievement, but it’s also human capacity. (DT) We don’t want to give you credit. (laughs) Human beings will like to take the credit. (DT) So, human capacity is really, don’t underestimate. (DT) Our problem is we are lazy. (DT) Extremely lazy (DT) Really. Specially when you have a better life. (DT) In the West (DT) Compare with Asia (DT) Or even compare with Eastern Europeans (DT) So, you’re more lazy. (DT) I should say we are more lazy, you know. (DT) Yes. So, that is our problem. (DT) Is not the human potential and human capacity (DT) That’s what it is. The laziness comes from various ways actually (DT)

0:09:01.9 Various ways. A lot of excuses. (DT) Or maybe genuine reasons (DT) Variety of ways, you know, variety of ways. (DT) Right?

Translator: Yes.

GR: You think so?

Translator: I think so.

GR: Should we bother to give examples or should we not bother to give examples?

Translator: I think you should bother.

GR: Should bother. Ok. The closest one or the distant one?

Translator: Closest one.

GR: Uh oh Uh oh. I’m in trouble. (laughs) Let’s. I come from Tibet. Right? And sometimes in good old Tibet the weather’s cold, of course, and dry. Sometimes people take bath once a year. (DT) And that’s laziness. (DT) And the excuse is the culture. (DT) And it’s not that; not that people don’t take bath. There’s some people who don’t take bath, who take bath once a year. There are other people who take bath every week or every month. Maybe not every day. I don’t know. (laughs) (DT) And that is one example. (DT) And there’s a lot of; lot of valid and invalid reasons and we will give excuse to ourself not to do. (DT) And most important thing is our spiritual development (DT)

0:12:00.6 And lot of people give excuse with that. (DT) The number one excuse is, “I’m not sure. I don’t know.” (DT) “And how do I know it works?” (DT) “And how do I know it is really genuine?” (DT) And then of course, we all went through, whether it’s the east or the west. You know, I had a. I had a dialog in Cleveland, two years; two years ago or something. A big dialog with the local clergies and me. We had a big dialog over the (DT) Maybe it’s just like two or three thousand people attended. We had a dialog. (DT) And I said, I said, as a, as we had in the East, you also have a tremendous corruption in the West of the Christian churches.

Translator: Did you say that?

Gr: Huh?

Tr: Did you say it or did?

GR: I said it. (DT) And I said the Tibetan monasteries have big corruptions. (DT) Because the monastery is involved in business. Monastery’s involved in, you know, bullying people. You know. All sorts of things. It’s true. They did. (DT) They did. (DT) You know why? Because they said, monastery is great. So, it’s most important thing is monastery. So, monastery’s interests become over the people’s livelihood.

Translator: More important than?

GR: Yeah. It’s over. You know, it becomes. The monastery’s wellbeing is become more important than the people’s food. (DT) And then, I said the same thing. I said, “You had the same thing in the Church.” (DT) “And that’s the problem where you drive the people away.” (DT)

0:15:07.6 And the head of the priest. He look at me. He said, “You can get away by saying that. I can’t say that. Otherwise tomorrow I’ll be questioned.“ (laughs) (DT) “Tomorrow I have to make explanation.” (DT) And that’s. That’s one of the reasons why people have been skeptical about spiritual path. (DT) Another reason is so many cult systems. (DT) Like the Applewhite. Do we need to talk Applewhite?

TR: Yesterday evening, I think.

GR; At night.

Tr: at night

GR: And so. I mean sorry. Ok. Anyway, like Applewhite. (DT) They don’t want to miss the bus behind the Hale-Bopp. (DT) What happened?

Audience: We call it a 0:16:42.1 (?)

GR: Huh?

Audience: Must call it a 0:16:45.2 male bop (?)

Tr: Hale-Bopp. Wow.I keep refusing them. I’m sorry. Keep trying. Hale-Bopp

GR: But the thing is, it’s amazing. Sometimes it’s amazing, you know? It’s amazing when you look at it. How many? You know, like twenty-nine or thirty, or some people committed suicide together. It is. It is horrifying and terrible and also amazing. How does the people think? (DT) Everybody. Everybody. Everybody had shaved their heads. So, whether you don’t know whether it is a man or woman. You don’t know. (DT) Everybody has nice little piece of dress (DT) Unified. Not uniformed. But everybody wears suit and pants, you know. (DT)

0:18:01.4 And they acted very nicely in the community. I mean, everybody over there committed suicide. Everybody in that village area. When they, the television people goes and interview and everybody was shocked. (DT) And one of the restaurant guys said, “Those lemon juice drinkers. They drink the lemon juice all the time. Lemon juice.” (DT) So, the next time when you see people drinking lemon juice. (DT) I mean, amazing. You know, why doesn’t they think? Carefully. You know, just, just think. Just think. He said, “there’s a vehicle waiting up there.“ Right? “So, you have to go.” And he says, “If you don’t go now, you’re going to miss it.” (DT) So, the vehicle means, they’re taking somewhere. (DT) Alright. So, which means. It makes sense, if we have physical body, we need a vehicle to lift up. Right? (DT) I mean, you’re committing suicide. (DT) So, you leave your body there. (DT) And so, what you going to do. What you going to drive then? (DT) Right? If your mind needs vehicle to go somewhere else, how you going to get from here to there? (laughs) (DT) So, all that doesn’t make sense to me at all. (DT) How can people think? (DT) Then, you know, the first question what I had. Because. Because, you know, it came in news and I was giving a talk there. And the people straightaway started asking questions. And then that Applewhite business. I heard before. The leader’s name is Applewhite. Right? Somebody asked me question in one of my public talks. “And what do you think about Applewhite?” And I have no idea. I don’t know who Applewhite is. Right?

0:21:04.3 So, I said, “Well, if he’s a devoted nice guy, must be nice guy.” (laughs) That’s what I make comment. And I was regretting later that I even made that comment. You know? So, anyway. Then I said. The first question I said, “Why? How can he come to such a conclusion?“ Not only his life. There are twenty-nine, thirty people who commit suicide together. Plus, they made an appeal to everybody; everybody to commit suicide. (laughs) (DT) Then Aura told me. And I said, “What kind of confirmation he got?” You know, I mean, you can’t just make big decision like that. What kind of confirmation? That this is the right time, he got it. (DT) Then Aura, one of our senior students at the center now she is doing PHD in psychology. So, she said, “You don’t need any confirmation.” (DT) I said, “How come?” She said, “Can be anything.” She said, “The guy may be driving through the street. The car before that’s license plate could be HI or HL. So, Hale-Bopp. For this eye, his confirmation. They can work.” (DT) So, it might be crazy, right? (DT) Got to be crazy. 0:23:53.5 (?) (DT) But how can a crazy person take thirty intelligent human beings together. This is. This is big shock to me. (DT)

0:24:12.2 So, it is very important for us. Really. To check. To confirm. Each and everything (DT) So, anyway one skeptical about spiritual path is not very good. On the other hand, things like that you have to be very careful. (DT) So, therefore, anything, whatever you do. You do. You check the path properly (DT) From top to bottom. (DT) In to out. Out to in. You know? In. Out. Everything. Top. Bottom. In. Out. Everything check properly (DT) Any such thing doesn’t make with the. Doesn’t make sense. And be watchful. (DT) And especially there are people who self-proclaimed gurus.

Tr: Sub proclaimed gurus.

GR: Gurus. Yes.

Tr: Self proclaimed

GR; Well, what did you hear?

Tr: Sub proclaimed.

GR: Self

Tr: Yes, I heard sub. S U B

GR: Oh no. No, no, no. Sorry. (DT) You know, I’ve been seeing. Now I’ve been like, you know, close to ten years in the West. And I been seeing it. There are people who say, “Hey. I’m your guru.” (laughs) (DT) And not only they tell you, “I’m your guru.” But they even call you. Amazing, you know. And really crazy. (DT) And they call you and they say, “I’m checking on you.” Or you know, all sorts of funny things. You know? (DT)

0:27:01.7 So, you know what. I mean, that’s maybe my next subject. Right? But. The subject for the next. What is it? Next week’s subject. But. I’d like to share that with you a little bit. You know, who chooses your guru? You choose. Not the guru doesn’t come and say, “Hey, I’m your guru.” No. Not at all. (DT) So, you choose your guru. (DT) If the guru try to choose you, run away. Really true. Run away. (DT) Run away five hundred miles without even looking back., you know (DT) Because it’s dangerous too, you know. Very dangerous. (DT) I mean, it is possible, even during the Buddha’s lifetime. There was a story called Angulimala. (DT) People know. People know. People want to be liberated. (DT) So, one of those self-proclaimed gurus says, “If you can kill one thousand human beings, 0:28:44.2 the week(?) and cut their thumbs and wear it as a rosary and come back to me and I’ll liberate you.” (DT) So, they killed one thousand; nine hundred, what is it? Nine hundred ninety-nine human beings. (DT) But luckily the last one happens to be the Buddha. (DT) So, the guy got helped later. (DT) So, this are the, what we, what the Buddhists call it, non-virtuous guide. (DT) The non-virtuous guide comes in the disguise of guru. (DT)

0:30:09.6 So, that creates tremendous problem. (DT) So, you’re right to be skeptical. (DT) But on the other hand, you also you cannot be skeptical throughout your life. (DT) So, then you know, what happens is doubt. Everything doubtful. Doubt. Doubt. Doubt. And then you’ll pass your life in doubt. (DT) So, then what happens is the opportunity that you have is totally robbed. (DT) Our life is such that we have a tremendous capacity. We talked yesterday, we said. We talked this morning. It is precious. It is important. It is wonderful. It can achieve everything. And I even said, Buddha was human being. Einstein was a human being. So, it shows. And I’m sure Marian Van Der Horst is human being too. Right? So, it shows. It shows the human potential and capacity. And this potential and capacity we can utilize when we are human beings. (DT) You got it, right? While we are human beings, we can utilize the human capacity. But when we cease to be human beings, then you cannot utilize the human capacity (DT) Human life is such thing. It’s like a clock. It clicks. (DT) It goes. (DT) It doesn’t wait. (DT) And I used to watch. Now I haven’t seen for years. There was a soap opera called, “Days of Our Life” (DT)

0:33:12.0 The reason why I was attracted to that soap opera. You know, they have a bottle of some sand or something. They have to turn upside down. And that goes through. And in the meanwhile they show the pictures here what’s happening here with people’s lives. In the meanwhile the sand is pouring down. (DT) That is exactly what is happening in our life. (DT) The moment we are born, the clock never stopped clicking (DT) It’s clicking, right? (DT) It’s going (DT) So, when it stopped, then we die. Right? (DT) So, in the meanwhile what we are doing. We are busy. (DT) We are busy with a little problems. (DT) Or we have a lot of deadlines. (DT) Scheduling (DT) I must go here. I must go there. I must be here. I must do this. I must do that. And you’re running here and running there. Running here. Running there. The clock is going. .(DT) At the same time. At the same time. We also engage in a lot of our tiny little things. (DT) And I have family problem. (DT) I’m fighting with my girlfriend (DT) I’m fighting with my boyfriend. Really true. What happened?

TR: Well, I translated it before you said it.

GR: Oh. I see. (laughs) Ok. Really true. And I have a psychological problem. And I have an emotional problem. I have this. I have that. I have a cold. I have this. I have that. I have to do this. So, we are busy in that. In the meanwhile, the clock is clicking. (DT)

0:36:15.6 The human capacity. The human capacity has demonstrated to us enough. Whatever you want to do, you have the capacity. They showed Buddha. They showed Einstein. They showed everything. Whatever you want to achieve, you can achieve. And the human capacity has demonstrated us enough. (DT) Yet, we are not taking the opportunity (DT) The opportunity is there. Right in front of us. (DT) The both of us. The speaker and you the listener. We, both of us. We have the opportunity in the right in front of us. And the speaker keep himself busy. Going here. Going there. And talking nonsense, all the time. (DT) And the listeners waste their opportunity by keeping yourself busy with the unnecessary schedules. (DT) And uncalled problems that we have. (DT) So, in this, in that, in the midst of the melodrama that we are playing, what’s happening? (DT) The bottle. The sand’s going down. (DT) So, the one day the sand up there is finished. (DT) Then, all of a sudden it stops. (DT) Pop. Then clock stops. (DT) Then what happens is we lost opportunity. (DT) But do we want that? (DT) That’s called waste of life. (DT)

0:39:04.8 Well, if you have some achievement, that’s fine. Even material. (DT) Good or bad. Whatever. You know. Achievement.

TR: Good or bad achievement.

GR: Yeah. If you have it. (DT) I didn’t say bad achievements are ok. But you have something to show. (DT) Yeah. I mean, we look back to Hitler today. (Dt) It may be bad. (DT) But he had something to show.(laughs) Even it’s bad. (DT) And what do we have? (laughs) (DT) And Mao (DT) It was a little bad. (DT) But he has something to show too. (DT) Even Saddam Hussein. And it may be bad. Who knows? (laughs) At least Bush says so. (DT) But even he has something to show. (DT) And then look at good ones. Look at Gandhi. (DT) Now, he has something to show. Right? (DT) And look at Martin Luther King. (DT) And look at Nelson Mandela. (DT) Mothe Teresa (DT) Or Dalai Lama. (DT) They have something to show. (DT) And what do we have? (DT) So, that’s called waste of life. (DT) Right? That’s called waste of life. (DT) If you are human enough. (DT) We should have human achievement. (DT) Either spiritual or even material (DT) Or something (DT) Everybody would like to look back. (DT) There was the poet, yesterday I talked. V0:42:00.2 (Gendun chun de)(DT)

0:42:05.9 And he said , “Every human beings have hope of looking back. Even after death.” (DT) So, they tried to leave something behind (DT) And some. Many people leave their children. (DT) Many people will leave their religious traditions, disciples, monasteries, temples and churches and memorial museums and this and that (DT) And then he wrote this in the introduction of a book. Dictionary book. (DT) And he says 0:43:02.5 (Tibetan: …) He said, the person like me, who neither have dharma nor have wealth and I’m the beggar. The beggar has nothing else to leave, like the other they mentioned before. (DT) But I leave here the little book to pay that I ate too much human food for so many years. (DT) Did you get it? Got the message. So, the important thing is, important thing is, we have to achieve something in life. (DT) And we don’t want to achieve like Hitler or Saddam Hussein or whoever, you know. All this Mao and all this. (DT) But we will like to achieve like Buddha, like Mahatma Gandhi, like all this good examples (DT) So, and why we are not achieving anything that you wanted to do. (DT) One reason and one reason only. You have not overcome the laziness. (DT)

0:45:04.5 Ok? Remember. The laziness comes in the form of headache. (DT) A family problem. (DT) Anything. (DT) And sometimes for no reason. You just don’t want to move. (DT) You just don’t want to do. (DT) We had a friend who’s ready to take her PhD. But she will not write her thesis. (DT) And she says, she has no time. (DT) And what does she do? (DT) Everything else except that. (DT) And she loves to volunteer, work with the, what do you call it? Green. The environmental group. (DT) And she volunteers with the Human Rights Society. (DT) Then she volunteers with the Asia watch. Whatever. (DT) So, she had time for everything except her own thesis. (DT) And when you encounter with her and try to tell her, that’s what you are doing. Then her excuse will be, “Well, I really don’t like the way I was supposed to write.” (DT) Then first was a problem with the committee (DT) Then the chairman. (DT) And then anything else. (DT) So, the laziness is manifested in that manner. (DT)

0:48:00.7 I’m not saying this problem are not real problem. They are real problem. (DT) But they are easy solutions. In each and every problem, easy solutions. You can take over. (DT) And you will not take that. (DT) Yet you submit yourself to the problem. (DT) And the consequences of that, you will destroy your PhD. (laughs) (DT) And the same thing. We are destroying our capacity and life. And the same consequences. (DT) So, this is how laziness manifested in any manner. In any form. In any way. (DT) There is no valid reason at all. At all for. For people to hold back. (DT) But (DT) And the laziness manifested or rather the laziness exaggerates a tremendous problem. (DT) Then we buy that (DT) And then we suffer under that. (DT) And the consequences of that. We defeat our life’s benefit. (DT) So, when you want to grow internally. Internal growth or whatever you call it. You call internal growth, right? When you want. I mean, whether you call it spiritual growth or whether you call it internal growth. It’s one of them is overcoming laziness (DT) So, how best way we can achieve this? (DT) Overcoming the laziness (DT) Is the impermanent.

TR: What do you mean?

GR: Impermanent. (DT)

0:51:06.4 A permanent that demonstrated us in very gross way is the death. (DT) It’s there. (DT) It’s coming (DT) Who knows, who goes? (DT) And when. (DT) It’s not certain that older people will go early. (DT) It is not certain the sick people will go early. (DT) There’s a tremendous uncertainty when it comes and who goes. (DT) I don’t have to tell you. You knew it. (DT) Simply, you’re not thinking about it. (DT) Or you refuse to think about it. (DT) Or you don’t want to think about it. (DT) Because you don’t like it. (DT) Ok. That will not help you. (DT) It will help you if you think. (DT) You don’t think the whole time in the world is in your, under your disposal. (DT) The limitation of the time. (DT) See? The morning comes. Evening comes. Night comes. Morning comes. (DT) But remember, the sand is running through that bottle. (DT) This is so important (DT) The remembering the impermanence and the death. (DT) And the Buddha said one of the most effective way of thinking. (DT) Buddha said the elephant imprint of the feet is the biggest of all animals. (DT) And impermanent and death is the most effective like that of elephant’s footprint. (DT) Remember? Ok? So, laziness is obstacle. (DT)

0:54:06.8 To overcome that; realizing how impermanent the life is. (DT) Ok. We spend our life. You know, one of the great teacher in Tibetan tradition. Somebody asked him to write his own biography. (DT) And then he said, “Oh. I have nothing to say.” Blah, blah, blah. (DT) The usual stuff. And they insist, “Yes, please say something.” (DT) Then he said, “Well, I spent twenty years of my life, first twenty years, thinking that I’m young and a kid.” (DT) And the next twenty years I spent that, “Oh. I would like to achieve something. I would like to do something.” So, I spent next twenty years that I’m thinking: I’m going to do something. I’m going to do something. (DT) The last twenty years, the third quarter, he said. Oh, I blow it. I couldn’t do it. I blow it. I couldn’t do it. (DT) So, whether he had blown it or he couldn’t do it, or not. But these are the guides. Guidance that he gave, given us. (DT) That’s how we. That’s how we spend our life. (DT) First twenty years thinking, I’m a kid. I can do anything. (DT) I’m a kid now. (DT) Next twenty years. I will do it. I will do it. I will do it. First, but I have to take this problem and second I will take care of that problem. Third, I have to do this. And then I will do it. Then I will do it.(DT) To begins with, let’s say. Let me explore the whole world and let me see how they are. (DT) Then next possible will be: Well, maybe this is good. Maybe that’s good. Maybe this. Maybe that. Oh. Maybe You know? (DT) And then the next thing will come. What? Well, that’s not right. That’s not right. That’s not right. That’s not right. (DT)

0:57:11.5 And then the next will be saying, “Oh yeah. I blow it out. I wasted. I wasted. I wasted.“ (DT) Ok, having said that. What did I offered you? I offered you a mirror. Mirror. (DT) And then you look in that mirror. (DT) And see, whether you fit in there. (DT) And if you find your, “Oh no, clothes” in there. (DT) And then remember you’re wasting your time. (DT) Do something else. (DT) Ok? (DT) So, a number of people raised hands. I ignored earlier because just wanted get that out of my chest. (laughs) (DT) So, now I’ll be happy to entertain your questions. So, first goes Marian 0:58:38.5 (?)

Questions: (Dutch)

Translator: In the example of the, the

GR: In the example of?

Translator: This lady who has to write her thesis for her PHD.

GR: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Whatever

Translator: So, then let’s say she sees what’s going on and she decides to write her thesis now. But then she becomes ill.

GR: She what?

Translator: She becomes ill

GR: Ill

Translator: She becomes ill. And then she has to spend all her time and her energy on this illness. Then what is laziness then, in that case?

GR: She’s right. You’re absolutely right. That is another circumstances in life. Right?

1:00:04.3 So, let’s look that way. Let’s look that way. So, what happened is, before she got sick, ill. Before she got ill, she entertained laziness. (DT) When you’re not well, of course there’s no question. You have to spend all of your energy to protect yourself. No question. (DT) But sometimes the illness will also have a certain advantage and disadvantage.

Translator: Advantage and disadvantage

GR: And disadvantage. (DT) Disadvantage is; is you cannot do anything you wanted to like when you’re well. (DT) Limitations. (DT) Advantage is. Now, advantage is, you can focus much better than anybody else. (DT) The attractions. The drawing attentions has been reduced. The word “reduced” is the word. (DT) So, PhD or no PhD, but you can get PhD in. You can get PhD in spiritual path. (DT) The good spiritual path is such a thing. Like, take Buddhism. Take Tibetan Buddhism. Tibetan Buddhism. You can look in Tibetan Buddhism as a great philosophy (DT) It is detail. It is comprehensive and it is complicated. (DT)

1:03:10.7 The. On the other hand. It is simple. It is easy. You don’t have to be philosopher. You can have a precise compact little practice which can be helpful and which you can achieve your goal. (DT You have both choice (DT) So. So, that’s the. The possibility is there. (DT) That is even advantage. (DT) Ok. It is of course, terrible indeed, when you get sick. But there are also advantages. (laughs) (DT) Ok. Any other questions? Yes. Lady over here. I’m sorry.

Question: (Dutch)

TR: What about the capacities or the possibilities of someone who is severely handicapped and who lives like a plant?

GR: Who lives like what?

TR: Like a plant. You know this.

GR: A plant. Well. Human suffering is unlimited. (DT) Like a plant. There’s. I don’t know whether it is 1:05:35.5 loose(?). Better to be in life or not? And that’s that question. (DT) It is human being. Sure. (DT) But lack of lot of qualities. (DT)

1:06:00.2 The capacity what we be talking about the human beings is; the capacity to be able to understand and to be able to act and to be able to function. Function not necessarily everything. But to be able to understand and act. Think and act. And that is the most important capacity. (DT) As you know. And when you don’t have that capacity, when you lose that capacity, then it is helpless. (DT) Even. People in coma. (DT) And you try to talk to the person in the coma. (DT) And you presume it. You would like to acknowledge that people understood you. (DT) But the true reality. Who knows? (DT) And these are the limitations. (DT) And sometimes we fall in that limitation. (DT) And when lucky, when we are not in that limitations. (DT) And if you have opportunity to think. (DT) That is important to appreciate. (DT) Even you may have other difficulties. (DT) But still you can communicate. (DT) You can understand. (DT) You can act. (DT) You can do (DT) So, that capacity has to be appreciated. And not only appreciate, take best advantage. (DT) Otherwise, still the time runs out. (DT) Really. You can’t hold the time back. (DT) There are stories, you know. Said some mahasiddha holding the sun. (Laughs) I don’t know. We can’t hold the time. You know. (DT)

1:09:13.2 Even Buddha’s gone. (DT) Jesus gone. (DT) Everybody. We talked today as though it had been yesterday day. You know? (DT) I think it’s been thousand years. (DT) See? And we talk as though it was ten years ago, or five years ago almost. (DT) But if you really think, it is thousand years. (DT) Two thousand years. ( DT) Two and a half thousand years. In the case of the Buddha. (DT) So, that’s it. So, we’re all here. (DT) We’re all on that time zone. (DT) And we are happy to be on the time zone. (DT) We’re happy not be in the twilight zone. You know what I mean?Rimpoche:….

Translator: No, I don’t

GR: Huh?

Translator: Twilight zone. Yeah. (Dutch)

GR: Twilight zone is crazy thing, you know.

Translator: I don’t know how to translate. I’m sorry.

GR: Ok. That’s fine. That’s fine. So. So, that’s ok. You know. Because people will have different views here and there. So, what I. Let me put the other way around. We are happy to be in the time zone and where we can do and cannot do. It’s in our own hands. (DT) Right now, the control is in our own hand. (DT) It’s in nobody’s hand. (DT) So, it’s your own choice. (DT) That‘s it. I have finished what I have to say (DT) There’s nothing more to add, really. (DT) But on the other hand I’m supposed to have three days here.(laughs) Just joking. (DT) It is time about twelve. Do I have to stop now? Little bit. Ok. You go ahead first.

1:11:55.4 Question: You say you have a choice. Now some people may say, they want to die. So, that’s their choice. Variations. There are people who are saying, if I get sick I don’t want those doctors who being busy with me all day long. They must let me. If I want to die, they must let me die. They must not prolong my life longer than necessary. Other people will say, bury me. I want an injection.(??) So, where is the balance.

GR: What would you say? Doctor 1:12:42.8 Yet(?)

Dr: I, as a doctor, find it is very difficult to terminate one’s life. Right?

GR: You’re right. The doctor’s job is to save life, rather than to end life. Right? But should doctor have the veto power, what to do, on the life of patient? That’s the question. The doctor’s point of view. The doctor’s job is to save life and not to end life. Which I hundred percent agree with you. But on the other hand, should doctor have veto power to do, what to do with life of other person? That’s big question. I don’t know. (DT) You know there’s a question of euthanasia. With this euthanasia, right? (DT) I live in Michigan. (DT) This Doctor Kevo. What is it? Kevorki. Doctor. Doctor that lives in Michigan too. (DT) You know, there’s a famous doctor in America. Not famous, but he’s well known because of his. His main business is euthanasia. (laughs) (DT) Kevo.

Audience: Kevorkian.

GR: Kevorkian. He comes from Middle East. (laughs)

Translator: What’s his name

GR: Kevorkian.

Translator: Kevorkian

GR Kevorkian. Right? (DT)

1:15:13.0 This is one of the, one of the biggest. What do you call it? That. Controversial in America. Been going on for years. (DT) The Kevorkian. Doctor Kevorkian, or whatever that guy is. Comes from Middle East. (DT)

Audience: (Dutch) Kevorkian

Translator: Kevorkian?

GR: That’s what they said. Kevorkian. His name. (DT) Whatever. He comes from Middle East. I don’t know. Anybody knows how to pronounce properly. Really. (DT) So, what happened is, he’s been, he’s been giving the. He’s been giving the assistance to the suicide. (DT) And what he does. He prepare everything and let the persons 1:16:26.5 dress(?). He doesn’t do it. Because of the law. (laughs) (DT) So, the Michigan government arrested him three or four times. (DT) And charged him with killing. (DT) And three times the government lost. He win. (DT) And finally they went to the Michigan Supreme Court. (DT) And he won. (DT) So, I mean, this is the biggest. One of the biggest issues. Not only in Michigan. Throughout the United States. (DT) So, let her finish. So, I saw. I don’t know. I put a lot of thoughts on this euthanasia, whatever you call it. Euthanasia. Right? Euthanasia. (DT) I don’t have conclusion. (DT) The other day I met 1:17:54.7 Sogyal (?) Rimpoche in Washington DC. (DT) And I told him, we need to sit down and talk. (DT)

1:18:09.3 So, it’s been nice to those Tibetan Buddhist teachers. At least. If not all Buddhist teachers. But the Tibetan Buddhist people and particularly people like us who goes around and talk a lot. And if we can sit down and think and have some kind of understanding. I don’t think we have any right to make any decisions. But some kind of understanding on the subject like this. You know, the euthanasia is one thing. Abortion is another thing. Nobody says abortion is good thing. But the question is the woman’s right. All of those, you know. And so, there are a lot of those social issues. If you can get some kind of understanding it would be helpful. (DT) Sogyal Rimpoche told me that; he said, “Let’s go and talk to His Holiness the Dalai Lama.“ That he’s there at that time. (DT) Oh. And I said, “No, no. Not right now.” I said, “Let us talk first and then see what comes out. And then we talk to Dalai Lama later.” (DT) Because if you go and talk to Dalai Lama, he may say, “Yeah, good.” Or “No, good.” Whichever, you know. It becomes a problem. (Laughs) You know what I mean? Really. If you say, “Yeah, it’s not good.” Then it becomes problem. If he says, “Yeah, maybe it’s ok.” Then it’s a bigger; another problem. So, let’s talk before.(laughs) (DT) It’s like pope. If the pope makes a fast decision in room, then you get, everybody get in trouble throughout the world, you know. (laughs) (DT) Whether it becomes too conservative or too liberal. (DT)

1:20:59.9 But I. As this pope is concerned, we don’t have to worry about the liberal ideas. (laughs) (DT) So, anyway. So, I’m glad you raised that question. I don’t have an answer. (DT) But that’s. We should think about it. (DT) Ok. I know you raised hand too. Is it something connected with this?

Question: 1:21:43.1 (??) What was persuading to that first Angulimala. If I count, Angulimala was waiting. (??) waiting., I was thinking that that was very lazy. He was happy to get rid of that mala. (DT) (??) Or was it compassion of the Buddha. We talked so much about so many different kind of aspect of life. Maybe it’s (??) Buddha’s compassion and that’s why. (DT) What was persuading?

GR: I don’t have an answer. (laughs) Today I don’t have any answer at all. (DT)

Questions: 1:23:02.1 (??) we talk more about compassion (??) (Dt)

GR: You know compassion is a buzz word. (DT) Sometimes a lot of people use that. Overuse it. (DT) And so, it sometimes lose the value of compassion. Compassion is beautiful, wonderful. But when you overuse the word, then it loses value, sometimes. (DT) Allen Ginsberg told me once, when I was talking compassion. He says, “Rimpoche, compassion is buzz word. Buzz word.”

1:24:06.5 Everybody talks a lot. Nobody does anything. (laughs) (DT) Buzz word. Anyway, I think we have to stop here. And thank you so much. And I thought we did. We talked important point this morning. And think about it. And then you didn’t talk anything today. I did lots. Lot of talking. And you should talk more in the afternoon. (laughs) (DT) Dying business. Yeah. Go ahead.

Audience 3: Question. Yeah. We talk about euthanasia. And often when people want euthanasia they want to escape suffering. And I was wondering from the Buddhist point of view, wouldn’t that be foolish? Have in mind that karma will still have its way, even after this person would have been. Would have died. And wouldn’t then, that karma still work on in the bardo and in the next life. (DT)

GR: Interesting question. I don’t know. But my think. My thing. My thinking is particular karma that people suffering, may be even interrupted when you die. Maybe interrupted. That doesn’t mean you have finished with that karma. It must be interrupted and suspended. Because when you die, certain dying karma has to take over. That does not mean two or three karma cannot function together. They can. However, my feeling is. I don’t know exactly. But my feeling is, they will interrupt that particular suffering karma. That doesn’t make then free for sure. You will somehow connect back and suffer. But it might be interrupting a little bit. I don’t know whether that is a new word for you. Don’t know. (DT)

1:27:32.3 On the other hand. On the other hand. I’m quite sure you have the right to die. That is another point. The other side of the point. (DT) It may be lack of understanding (DT) It may be foolish (DT). It may be; can’t help it. (DT) But whatever it might be, I’m quite sure they have a right to die. Though Vajrayana Buddhist point of view, if you kill yourself you have downfall of killing an enlightened being or something. (DT)

Translator: I missed

GR: Killing a yidam. (DT) But downfalls are downfalls (DT) I really wanted to share that with you. A lot of people wanted to be right thing to do. Too much righteousness. (DT) That’s the right thing to do and that’s not the right thing to do. (DT) You will have a big decision on that. (DT) Not almost a judgement. (DT) Truly speaking, to do everything right is impossible. (DT) One time I was caught in the middle of a conversation. It’s the same thing. It’s Tricycle. You know, Tricycle is that magazine. It is Tricycle or something. Middle of some conversation. It is the vegetarian vs non-vegetarian conversation (DT)

Robert: Long hair

Lama Pema: Yeah

Robert: Long sadhu hair.

Rimpoche: ..

Lama Pema: …Genuine.

Rimpoche:

(Hmm. Otherwise, I’ll fall asleep. When Tibetan tells a story, you don’t tell a story in daylight. You know, like, the light on. You have no books, nothing. You all sleep and mother has to tell story and children has to say in the dark, hmm peewr. Kind of say. The biggest

Robert: You lure to sleep by pretending to go ho hum.

Lama Pema: it’s still. So, the mother will know whether you are actually sleeping or still listening.

Robert: Otherwise

Lama Pema: So, the. He. The. So, that what actually decided all this, when he debated and he became first teacher who actually are exposed to the other Buddhist system belief. And then come in contact and debated and defeated in an open, open tournament. So, it is again for the Tibetan history something to noted. You know, to think about it. In India a lot of thing happen like that. You know, Indian Buddhist debating Buddhism and the winning and so forth.

0:03:00.5 So, his fame actually spread all over India, Tibet and the Chinese, China. The then China, who was recently ruled by the Mongol China. Respect all over So, the. So, the. It was the same time when Tibet after the king Langdarma’s death, until Sapan’s time, as I said earlier, Tibet is kind of interspersed. Has no central rule. No central thing to look for. Everybody’s sort oflike, having a small like curtain(?) states of united. Something like that. It’s kind of like that. So, the. It was for the Tibetans, it was Sapan’s great name, greased. While we call, actually Sapan’s great compassion. His far. That really helped save the Tibetans to, from that time until now, 1959 to come into this kind of integrated, kind of Tibet as overall thing. That’s how I should say it. If I’m wrong you have to forgive.

Robert:……

Lama Pema: It’s my perception, now. Doesn’t mean anything. And it is it is not because it is warfare, fighting war for anything. Nothing. It’s just the learning. This inner sage/search?. That really saved. Just as you have, what do you call? Maybe it is difficult to understand. Like the, when Milton wrote a poem, he saved the country from the war. Do you know that story? Something like that. Of course, totally different way of looking at it. But something like, this one person saved the whole Tibet from the destruction and later what Tibet actually came to be, integral Tibet. Our eng political upheaval or you know, attempt to rule one another. The Sapan, Mongols, Genghis Khan, actually ruled the China, and actually took over Tibet. Just a few wars and Tibet just simply said yes. And started giving the, what do you call it, tributary? Tributes.

Robert: tributes

Lama Pema: tributes. Yeah. After the Genghis Khan death, Tibet stopped paying it. So, they thought they were free, now since he is dead. So, Genghis Khan’s son, actually Godan is aneckan grandson. Godan. He sent lute army into Tibet and he actually again, came up and killed thousands of monks, burned hundreds of monasteries, and came all the way up to the center of Tibet. So, there was a time when Godan was very much need, for many needs. One need; he wasn’t in need of power anymore from Tibet. He don’t need any wealth, anymore. Because Tibet doesn’t look anyway like you could get anything out of that.

0:06:09.6 But actually what you are looking for is an enlightened teacher. He was looking for that. He sent his minister called, Dorta and Leje. The two minister to look, what is there in Tibet you can find it. And look whether you can find a great teacher, because I need that. So, they looked around and they saw different traditions, like Drikungpa and Kadampa and so forth. And all the teacher, at that time is the greatest teacher seems to be the Sakya Pandita. So, and then the, what do you call. I want to read the, what do you call, the story, the invitation. Basically, it was a. It wasn’t quite an invitation, but the. The. It’s a kind of a. Well, since you will never have time to look at those histories, but this is time, just hear something about it. It will be nice. So, he sent an invitation, saying, “I, the most powerful perse perse King Godan wishing for Sakya Pandita Kunga Gyaltsen. That we need a lama to advise my ignorant people on how to conduct themselves, morally and spiritually. I need someone to pray for the welfare for my deceased parents.” That was another reason. “To whom I am deeply grateful. I have been pondering this problem for some time and after much consideration, I have decided that you are the only person suitable for the task. As you are the only lama I have chosen, I will not accept any excuse on account of your age.” Because Sapan is very old at that time, over sixty years old. Over sixty years. “Or the vigors of the journey. The Lord Buddha gave his life for all living beings.” Here he’s cause. He’s already learned because China at that time is, I think, half the world at that time is Buddhist. Do you know that time? Because almost all China is Buddhist. So, he knows all about the Buddha’s teaching. All he needs is a teacher, actually a teacher. “Lord Buddha gave his life for all living beings. Would you not therefore,, be denying your faith if you try to avoid this duty of yours? It would of course be easy for me to send a large body of troops to bring you here. But in so doing harm and unhappiness ;might be brought to many units and living beings. In the interest of Buddhist faith and welfare of all living beings, creatures, I suggest that you come to us immediately.” (laughter)

0:08:50.6 The. The. That’s the thing and then later on the actually the story runs. How you know, Sapan has to write lot of letters because Tibetans need him much back in Tibet. And he wrote a letter to Kadampa, one of the Kadampas students called Kadampa 0:09:04.7Namkha Drak/Bum(?) This Kadampa 0:09:06.8 Namkha Drak(?) for scholar is useful is one of Kadampa school and become the very much student of Sapan and later on is a student; became a great teacher. So, he wrote these to, as answers to certain letters to Namkha Drak. He said, “These Mongols have told me that you must at any rate come to be our religious teacher and if you will not come, there will be war. Therefore it is better that I go with them, for fear that Tibet would suffer if war break out. I have no more than a hope that, that will bring, that will be benefited by my doing. Yet I have no certainty it will be so. Nonetheless, I know I can give my body in life if that will bring benefit for living beings.” Now, to the Buddhist, that is, more than anything else, if a person can give up one’s body for sentient beings, then that is actually shows when you attain the stage called bodhisattva bhumi. The actual intentional, of thoughtful meaningful giving only is the sign. You can read the Ahisamayalankara. You know, how you, when you reach the such and such state, what is your outward sign of inward experience. That is exactly when you receive such and such. So, that actually shows, he’s the great enlightened teacher. Now, so, Sapan went to India, went to Mongol China, up to all the way down to the placed called Liangzhou/Lingchu? Len chow? How do you pronounce?

Robert: Leng cho

(insert time here) Lama Pema: Len chow. And he took, actually, three actual almost three years to get there. The what, passing through the Lhasa, Samye Monastery, and basically Sapan’s teaching headquarter, later Lingchu and previously sachu? And the Samye in the Lhasa. These are the three places of his major teaching places. So, in Samye, he basically, what do you call, renovated the kind of dilapidated Samye Monastery. And painted the monastery. He even created a famous painting called 0:11:24.7 Dom Sum Tenba(?) Dom Sum Tanba. That year. Of all the Tibetan, what do you call it? Of all the Tibetan style of painting, the when you see the sword, you know, basically you can guess, you know. Roughly you guess this is; this original painting comes from this very famous painting there. He painted in the walls of Samye Monastery and put the, wrote a poem about it. And you can still look at it. You can see every now and them. You can come across Tibetan book or many translated books. So, he passed through the Samye and that is where, actually, the, his nephew who is ten years old, called Phagpa became ordained in Samye Monastery. So, when he went to, finally we see, landed in China in Liangzhou, he was then led by the Godan, who was just enthroned as the king. And they, they both turned cloth,we call fen la, the fen means the chieftain or king or whatever. La means the teacher. For the teacher, what we call, later, what you call in the Western term, Priest, patron top type of thing. They met. And there actually, Sapan’s great impact on their lives was, what do you call? The, when he started teaching and introducing the Tibetan Vajrayana teaching for the first time. First, initiating the king himself. So, those are the time. It is a little bit, not too widely known in the general folks. But usually, you know, like anything else, the chieftains, the teacher; actually owns the teacher. You know, once he invites. So. So, again, the tantric Buddhism is especially difficult to develop, because teaching only can be given for twenty-five students. So, he limit yourself and you can’t reach. So, the; he taught and another thing, a significant thing that Sapan did directly to the Godan is because one of the reasons Godan, actually, his mundane reason was to heal him from this, what do you call? He suffering from leper, leprosy, and Sapan actually, through the, 0:13:42.5( mantra path Maitripa (singhanada)?), healed this leprosy at that time. So, the king gained a lot of path and very much devoted to the Buddhism. There is more of an esoteric aspect of the story; inner story usually gets by scholars and Tibetan delivers that actually was the; since king is Buddhist, he need a great Buddhist teacher to actually, to solve the problem that they are having at that time, between the Confucianism, Taoism, and Buddhism. That is supposed to be. Some scholar thinks that way. Maybe wrong. Maybe just their supposition. Half heard issues. But that is one of the reasons because, the name that reach China is primarily not just the word of the messenger told him, but because this famous name, when he debated Indian logicians and teacher. Respectfrom what do you call it? gabbyhor. Tibet; hor means Mongol and then China. So sort of everybody sort of knew like we know right now the, you know, like, what do you call it, nuclear war, something. We know. We know all about it. At that time.

0:14:57.7 That is another reason, he was looking for spiritual teacher who can actually solve the problem there, but unfortunately Sapan lived only for six years or something. He didn’t live much in China. There was a repeated request by the Tibetan. And he wrote repeated letters, such as a letter to the Tibetans and all. And letter to my students. A letter to such and such. A letter to answer to the prince. A letter. So, in these collection of works, you can read all kinds of letters. The. In his collection of works, you can find. Usually connect with the spiritual work. Basically Sapan on the other hand is very much help in the most spiritual method to protect the Tibetan from the destruction. So, they have their own independence in their own way. And basically, pleasing, taking care of the king, by his own spiritual power. That is how the first time the priest as king was actually coming up at that time. And we know our present king and teacher and leader, His Holiness Dalai Lama. It’s a similar, similar form. Just the same thing. These are the, what do you call, the original, the earliest form of the priest king, that happened to be. The. So, Sapan actually wrote over hundred and forty works, dependent on different lengths. The famous are the thing called, the Dom Sum. The Treasury. Now the Legs Shad is the kind of go collection of elegant saying. This is the mark of all the Tibetans, even now. It is so widely spoken, world renowned. And all other books, basically the writing is esoteric. The Vajrayana form of Buddhism which doesn’t make sense to you right now. And the. The one of the most contribution that he gave in the form of writing and studying is this called: Mams Jug. How do you call Mams Jug? Lexicon.

Robert: Mams Jug, the

Lama Pema: How do you say in English.

Robert: Lexicon. Encyclopedia.

Lama Pema: Yeah. Encyclopedia, which doesn’t exist. And he started writing. Translating for the first time, for the what do you call? Poetry from India to Tibet. Sanskrit in Tibet. Which later became the authoritative text written by the Gundee. The poet in India. And he started studying it. He wrote drama. He wrote all kinds of, in other words, I told you before.

0:17:41.9 So, one of the most important thing he wrote is, in the later part of his, later few days of his life, which had extended over two years, in China, he wrote the thing called the letter to do, letter to all the Tibetans, he wrote. And then the religious text called, Sage’s Intent. Means the teaching, summarizing all Buddha’s teaching. Giving the title, it’s what Buddha intend to teach, you know. It’s called Sage’s Intent. He’s saying these two books and basically he, in those letters, he really said, he’s unable to come back to Tibet. He basically gave up that he is going to live forever, the rest of his life, no matter how he’s living. And that became legacy as he kind of lost whatever, the things to give back to the Tibet. So, over that years, I’m telling this story just to kind of give you a kind of basis, a conception, a kind of person; a teacher. Not to, I’m not digging how great he is, how smart. I’m not digging part. You are the one who is going to judge, if you want to study further. Now, those are the days. Actually, of Kublai Khan, the great king. Maybe you have book, you have the book specific. Kublai Khan is the another king new to the Godan. I think he is successor, yes?

Robert: Yes

Lama Pema: The. He actually definitely want Sapan to come back to his place, by the time Sapan passed away. So, Godan also died at the same time. Same. Basically the same year. But what left behind, this is the Phagpa. In China, Chinese call fossil. Phagpa. His original name’s Chogyal Phagpa. Means the dharma king. Dharma King. Do you see this? The original first word, Dharma King. The Dharma King, Chogyal Phagpa is only nineteen years old. He’s a kid. Right? From the teen years. And the. But he. Because he’s learning, he’s scholar. Because he’s great sage himself. He actually learn all he needs to learn from Sakya Pandita. And Sakya Pandita finally said, “You have learned everything that I have to teach you. Now I’m giving you my dharma heir, as my dharma heir.” So, he give his gold status of Buddha and a conch shell as a kind of, whatever, that’s the tradition to do, the teacher to give student.

0:20:23.0 So, the Phagpa who’s only nineteen year old, took over the charge to actusfsf, to as the religious heir to Sapan and this Phagpa, who is nineteen year old, actually influenced the king so much, turned then into Vajrayana Buddhist, gave the initiation and he’s the one first to conquer. Basically, through the spiritual power, to Tibet, back to Tibet himself, without even killing one person. And he gave Tibet back to Tibet itself. In other words, as a token of the offering, of the gift, to the dharma gift that Phagpa gave to Kublai Khan. Kublai Khan gave him back Tibet to these, what do you call? To this great teacher. Later he also gave him Imperial Preceptor as the title. They call it 0:21:16.1 Guoshi(?) in China, which king, teacher or something. So, this Phagpa became very instrumental for the Kublai Khan’s purpose. Because Phagpa, actually, for the rest of his life, except for almost about eight years of his life, he actually spend most of life, (eighteen years in Tibet, probably, all in all) in China. So, the. Of course that means he had already mastered the Chinese language by now. So, he is the one who is about at that time, about twenty-seven or something, or twenty-nine, who actually resolved the. Who actually participated in the debate between the two hundred Buddhists, two hundred Taoist, two hundred Confucians, in the place called 0:22:13.9 (????) (Kaiping???) I don’t know much about it. locality called Karakrum. And he’s the, a kind of, the hero of that debate and basically defeated the, what do you call? Taoist beliefs of certain things. Here it says something or other. He. The. The. In other words, there was a strong belief within the Taoist that even actually proved that how the text go here ching which translate as conversion of the Taoism, that it is false. The only text that is true, actually true is the what do you call it? The other I Ching. I think I ching is the only text that is the right thing. In other words, he actually took over this kind of same thing that Sapan, his uncle actually took in it’s, in Tibet.

0:23:19.7 Not only that, there are different problems with different scholars. Some say Sapan. Some say Phagpa. But one way another, one of the teacher actually devised for the first time a script for Mongolian to facilitate this existing colloquial language to translate entire Buddhist canon into that language. And he, he invented a script called phags-pa script in the letter, his name. And that is the very much look like Tibetan. You can see, if you find a book. The. And. And through his inspiration, the Mongolians really undertook to actually translate the Buddhist canon. And that didn’t took more than three, thirty years or something. It was translated back in Tibet, in Mongolian. So, the basically, Phagpa is the one who, who regained this Tibet back to the Tibetans, themselves. So, all this teacher, I’m not going to list other teachers that we have in our texts. The letter teachers. So, in other words, the power and the realization, the understanding of those great teachers is actually what they call the study and the practice of this specific cycle of the tantra called the Hevajra. And that is the cycle of tantra, which the overall corpus of Lamdre, is actually explain it. And that is still taught and we still have this lineage. You don’t have to worry that its scattered away some more time. It is still alive. You know, you want a love them, you can cuddle them. You know, you can adopt them neither. Whatever you want. It’s still taught in a living tradition. And the, this is the, that same power, that actually got these teachers enlightened and these beings benefited and liberated. And these Tibetan people who enjoy the lasting peace for several centuries, such as these teachings. So, to the others; other religious system, you have teaching called Lam Rim. To the Gelugpa system, you have Lam Rim .To the Kagyu system you have this called the Six Yogas of Naropa. You know, doesn’t mean anything different, but a special kind of, each carrying their own kind of certain aspect of Buddhism as whole. And to the Nyingmapa, you know, the Dzogpa Chenpo, the great compassion and so forth. This. So, this is actually. How much time do we have?

Robert: 0:26:05.8 (Tibetan: rt and lp)

0:26:31.0 Lama Pema: So, the. So, the Lamdre system as the, what do you call? That is what has been practiced. And if you want to study, you can study now. In writing the preliminary books, reading the books, studying under the teachers of your own way. And so forth. But the. As the main style, the whole thing is the tantric system, based on the Hevajra tantra. Is the little bit successful because, by, because its nature of secrecy. That’s the only problem for the public has it. So, you have to give up lot to finally come to this point. You know. Even your ideas, even yourself, any, everything. You basically make yourself non-being and make a being out of that. The. The. So, this Lamdre system is actually again, same thing. Has been preserved, practiced, by the same Khon family. Same Khon family. So, the same Khon family. One of the interesting things to me. I don’t know for you. This. We have a definite record of these, how many years? Of about twelve hundred years, this family lineage. A direct lineage. One after another. That is something. You know, if nothing else. And the, and still exists. The Khon family still exists in the form of the emanation of Manjushri. His Holiness Sakya Trizin in India, Present head of Sakya family; Sakya tradition school and both. Another branch of family lives in Seattle, called 0:28:16.1 Dagchen Rimpoche. Same thing. And they are the one who holds this, this Lamdre system and who teaches. But that doesn’t mean that other teacher, so far doesn’t have any responsibility or have no share or something. Doesn’t mean. But this family took over, like you took over certain children to adopt and save life. In same way, this family actually took over sometime as the king, sometime as priest, sometime as landlords, sometime as chieftains. Basically whatever form they are took over the place of Sakya and preserved to the Lamdre system there. And basically taught in Tibet, these three great places. Which later the Sakya school developed itself. The three school called: Ngor school. Most of the painting you saw, very much